Crown and Sceptre, Chelmsford, Essex

Discussion in 'Brewers & Licensed Victuallers' started by Findem, Jan 11, 2016.

  1. Findem

    Findem The Fearless One. Rest in Peace.

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    Wondering what my chances are of checking out an ancestor, I suspect nil.

    His name is John Barker who married Judith Shippey at Widford, Essex in 1713.

    When their first child, daughter Judith, was buried in 1714 her burial entry noted she was an infant and "daughter of John at the Crown & Sceptre in Chelmsford"

    What I would like to know, if possible, was he the owner, a publican running the place for someone else, just a pub worker or simply living there.

    From baptism entries of other children he was said to be a Knacker and a Collar Maker.

    Does anyone know of a site where I might find any info, tried a Google got several hits for Crown & Sceptre but none in Chelmsford, none of the hits were of a historical nature.

    I started out having another try at finding the baptism of John's wife Judith Shippey aka Sheepy c1692 and having failed miserably on Free Reg, FMP, F S and The Genealogist, it rekindled my interest in John's occupations, thought it would be interesting combination of occupations if he was a Knacker, Collar Maker and a Publican.
     
  2. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    I got excited in the Gazetteers pages for a time but it was a non event, sorry Derek. Old pubs no help either. must away to type some pages for Himself now.
     
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  3. Findem

    Findem The Fearless One. Rest in Peace.

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    Thanks for checking.
     
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  4. Daft Bat

    Daft Bat Administrator. Chief cook & bottle washer! Staff Member

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    Although the licencing of Alehouses started in 1551, registers of these were not ordered to be kept until the Licencing Act of 1753, so there might not be a record surviving of such. :( If there is, though, the the Essex RO should have it :)
     
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  5. Eve

    Eve Well-Known Member

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    ale and hearty.co.uk has a leaflet on pubs of Chelmsford
    Has a brief mention, of a Crown & Sceptre bit later dates but as it was previously an Inn for so long, maybe a possible location?

    "18 – 20 Tindal Street
    Bear later Crown and Sceptre
    It was mentioned in 1571 as owned by Walter Baker Brewery and his adjoining inn, The Bear. The Bear had a Hearth Tax of 5 in 1671. The name Crown and Sceptre appeared in the Essex Chronicle in September 1764 but by 1787 had ceased business. Demolished and replaced by three brick-built shops."
     
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  6. Eve

    Eve Well-Known Member

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    An article in the moulsham times by John Power would appear to differ !

    moulsham times.com/july2013.pdf

    "By this time (only ref I can see is post 1692) Back Lane contained the Bear, which became the Royal Oak, the Bull became the Crown and Sceptre, the Spotted Dog, Rose, Unicorn and and Dolphin continued."
     
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  7. Findem

    Findem The Fearless One. Rest in Peace.

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    Thanks to all for your contributions, it has blown my mind somewhat to have yet another example of having been where one on my ancestors, John Barker, hung out but this time as far back as in the early 1700s. The number of times I've walked in Tindall Street both before and after coming to Australia is beyond counting, if I had a Pound, or a Dollar, for each time I would be very wealthy.

    Almost without fail, when single and working, on a Saturday morning my two best mates and I would go to into Chelmsford town. After a walk round town which included an obligatory visit to Woolworths and Marks and Spencers to try and chat up the shop girls, or any girls come to that, mostly with disappointing results :D. Then off to the good old Long Bar Cafe for a coffee or soft drink, then up to Dace's Music shop on the corner of Tindall Street and (I think) London Road, hear four of the latest records, I'd buy one or sometimes two records. Following that up Tindall Street and Duke Street to the Eastern National bus station and home for lunch.

    Good days were those, simple pleasures but great, it's terrible isn't it, you have to get to be elderly to really appreciate just how good those days were.
     
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  8. LianeH

    LianeH Well-Known Member

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    Derek, as I'm sure ou will have noticed on your last visit home, Chelmsford has changed so much but looking at the Chelmsford remembered site on Facebook it's really fascinating looking at the really old photos, seeing familiar streets as they were.

    Whereabout in Chelmsford did you live. I'm actually a Writtle girl but have lived in different areas of Chelmsford in my adult life.
     
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  9. Findem

    Findem The Fearless One. Rest in Peace.

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    In my early years I lived in first West Avenue then when around three or four years old we moved across the road to North Avenue. A short while before leaving school we moved into a house on the Melbourne Park Estate, ironically to Canberra Close, I guess fate was sending me a message, although fate got the state wrong. :D

    After spending about the first four years of marriage at Danbury my wife, son and I moved into a house on the Westlands Estate, so not far from Writtle.

    What parts have you lived in Liane?
     
  10. LianeH

    LianeH Well-Known Member

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    Lived most of my childhood (from age 3) in Writtle (the pond and green are still my favourite places ever), then moved to Galleywood, before Writtle Road, then Lawn Lane, Springfield before out to Great Notley, now back in Chelmsford just off Broomfield Road. Hubby and I worked out this is our seventh house and we've only been together 24 years!!! I know the westlands estate well having gone to Hylands School (formerly Westlands). Fate certainly was telling you something Derek but fate can't always get the details right:D
     
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  11. Findem

    Findem The Fearless One. Rest in Peace.

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    Yes over the years I have noticed the changes especially outside of town it really has expanded. I really like the mall effect in the centre of town, with no traffic and being able to wander across what was a road in my time, sit and watch the passing parade for a while, when the weather permits of course.

    I am saddened a bit with the Melbourne Estate, for one thing I didn't like the block of flats they erected opposite the shop, ugly great thing, stuck out like a sore thumb, I believe it's been demolished, good riddance. There seems to be a lot of rubbish laying around the place now, which is a shame.

    Canberra Close became not such a nice place as I knew it, a couple of families moved in who should have been kept in an animal enclosure, I suppose the nearest Zoo was full up :D. When I lived there we shared Canberra Close with some very nice people.

    Btw I do like the way the brick built car park near (across the road) Tesco was designed to fit in with the area rather than being just another concrete block.

    Still love the place though.
     
  12. Findem

    Findem The Fearless One. Rest in Peace.

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    We often walked with our children to Writtle Green area, a nice evening walk that.
     
  13. Findem

    Findem The Fearless One. Rest in Peace.

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    Forgot to mention Broomfield Road is another ancestor location, my great grandfather William Card had a Blacksmith shop up near the Angel Pub but on the other side of the road.

    You probably live not too far from where a German Parachute bomb landed in WW2. Coming from Broomfield Road, just off the left hand side of Patching Hall Lane, there was a Marconi building, from memory I don't think it was hit but close enough to damage it. It also blew out windows in the Tennyson Road, Brownings Road area. We heard that some women manged to find enough pieces of the parachute to make themselves some silk underwear, I used to have about a two inch piece of a parachute strap from the bomb, I found it near the scene.

    That Marconi building was located abutting an area known as The Dell which contained two ponds and Newts, I doubt The Dell exists now.
     
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