Could I have some thoughts please?

Findem

Findem

The Fearless One. Rest in Peace.
It concerns the burial of Maria Fowell (Fewell) 16 Apr 1606 at Ingatestone, Essex, spouse stated to be Roberti Fowell.

Would it be correct to presume that her husband Robert was still alive in 1606?

The family I'm looking at is of Robartt Fewell and his wife Marie Boughtell who married 20 Apr 1581 at Withersfield, Suffolk.
They had a son Giles who was baptised 12 Mar 1581 at Withersfield, Suffolk, so far no other siblings found.

Giles Fewell , or Aegidis as he appears in Thaxted PRs, married Elizabetha Trueman 29 Jun 1603 at Thaxted.

The above info corresponds with the research of the Reverend Mills (deceased).

I can only find burials for two Robert Fewells in the EPRI: -
Robert Fewell buried 5 Aug 1589 at Thaxted no identifying details attached to the entry.
Robert Fewell buried 27 Oct 1631 at Dagenham, again no identifying details.

I did find what I think is another Robert Fewell Baptism, Robert Fyll son of Johis baptised 17 Feb 1590 at Dunton, Essex, Dunton is near Laindon. Just for the record also a sister Judith Fyll baptised 1 Apr 1595 at Dunton.

With the burial of Maria at Ingatestone in mind, I did find two children baptised at nearby Shenfield, Jeremy Fowell 16 Mar 1588 and Thomas Fowell 27 Mar 1590, unfortunately no parent names given.

It is possible I suppose that the parents moved to Shenfield or Ingatestone after Giles was born and baptised in Suffolk and Giles ended up in Thaxted eventually, sometime before 1603.

So, would it be correct to presume that Maria Fowell's husband Robert was still alive in 1606?
 
I have found quite a few examples where the husband pre-deceased the wife but was named on the wife's headstone and death record. I think that the husband is usually named whether or not he pre-deceased the wife because a woman was defined by her husband and his name in past times. And unfortunately still so in most places.
 
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i was inclined to think Robert was still alive but felt the need to get opinions from others, had the Robert buried in 1589 at Thaxted been buried there after 1606 I would have felt more confident. I suppose in a way Robert being buried in 1631 at Dagenham threw me a bit but I suppose he could have gone to live with one of his children after Maria died and if he had been living at Shenfield or Ingatestone they are not too far from Dagenham.

I am beginning to think the two children baptised at Shenfield might well be the the children of the Robert and Marie/Maria Fewell of Suffolk origins, I have seen Fewell spelled elsewhere in Essex as Fowell. I'll have to have a rummage around to see if I can find more children of Robert & Maria, although lord only knows what shape the surname will be. :)
 
I believe I've found another child for the family of Robert & Marie/Maria Fewell.

Ludovicus Fowell baptised 12 Apr 1607 at Ingatestone, father is Roberti.

So for the Robots or anyone else interested here is the possible family for Robert Fewell and his wife Marie Boughtell who married 20 Apr 1581 at Withersfield, Suffolk.

Giles Fewell baptised 12 Mar 1581 Withersfield.
Jeremy Fowell bap 16 Mar 1588 Shenfield, Essex.
Thomas Fowell bap 27 Mar 1590 Shenfield, Essex.
Henricus Fowell bap 14 Apr 1604 Ingatestone, Essex.
Ludovicus Fowell bap 12 Apr 1607 Ingatestone, Essex.

I'm wondering if the Robert Fewell buried 5 Aug 1589 at Thaxted is the son of Robert and Marie Fewell, probably born between Giles 1581 and Jeremy 1588. Perhaps he followed Giles to Thaxted or went with him, alternatively Robert and his wife Marie moved to Thaxted and then moved on to Shenfield.

I suspect but cannot prove that the Robert Fewell buried 27 Oct 1631 at Dagenham might be Robert Fewell husband of Marie, shame there was no noted "Widdower", or "son of" etc.

Also wondering if the birth date for Giles in the PR is 12 Mar 1582 not 1581, or perhaps the marriage date for Robert and Marie should be 20 Apr 1580 instead of 1581. I'm a bit suspicious that Giles was born approximately six weeks before Robert and Marie married, although I have an instance of that happening in the Fewell line in 1768, an Elizabeth Fewell baptised 24 April 1768 at Felsted, noted as "daughter of William Fewell and his wife Margaret" and the parents married 3 May 1768 at Felsted.

I have a feeling there must be other children born between 1581 and 1588, perhaps if the Suffolk R O get a grip and get the Suffolk PRs digitised, in my lifetime, perhaps all will be revealed. I understand Family Search have offered to do the digitising free, surely there's scope there to get the job done rather than keep on dithering.
 
Findem said:
Also wondering if the birth date for Giles in the PR is 12 Mar 1582 not 1581, or perhaps the marriage date for Robert and Marie should be 20 Apr 1580 instead of 1581. I'm a bit suspicious that Giles was born approximately six weeks before Robert and Marie married...
Click to expand...
Two words - Julian Calendar ;)

If the entries are both clearly listed in the register as 1581 there's no need to worry. Until 1752 New Year's Day was 25 March, so in any given year 12 March was nearly 11 months after 20 April.

The recommended way to refer to a date between 1 January and 24 March would be 12 March 1581/82, meaning 1581 in the Julian Calendar then in use, which translates to 1582 in the Gregorian one we now use. (These are also sometimes referred to as Old Style (O.S.) and New Style (N.S.))
 
Thanks for pointing that out Arthur, where on earth was my brain that day, can't believe I missed that, a real der moment.

On my Family Group Sheet blank in Excel, there is a footnote regarding the Julian Calendar, so every time I fill out a F G S with a new found family I see that note and just lately I've filled out quite a few.
 
I think I'm going to have to just go with Giles Fewell as a child of Robert Fewell and his wife Marie Boughtell, I have searched on the EPRI, FreeReg and Family Search but cannot find a likely marriage, the only Robert Fewell marriages I can find are The Withersfield couple and the Robert Fowell who married Maria Willet in 1605 at Ingatestone.

I am aware there was a Robert Fewell baptising one or more children in Thaxted around the same time as Giles, not sure where he came from but I'm speculating perhaps a brother of Giles possibly baptised somewhere in Suffolk.

Just realised I haven't tried FMP for Robert Fewell marriages, a job for after lunch.
 
Thanks for that Sue, that is interesting and unexpected.

Oh lord, so we have another Clergyman in the family, my maternal grandfather Frank Card was a lay preacher in the Primitive Methodist lot, not ordained of course.

That's set me thinking, now I wonder, is that how the Reverend Mills was able to see the connection of the Withersfield Suffolk Fewells to the Thaxted Essex Fewells?

Could be the reason for Robert Fewell coming to Essex.

It was the son of the deceased Revd. Mills who advised us of the Suffolk connection, the son recalled seeing the details, he was a little off track with a couple of Essex parishes but I managed to correct that, basically though the info was good. The son was going to try and get into his father's computer for accurate info and get back to us, we never heard from him again, mind you I'm very grateful to him for putting us Fewell researchers on the right track.

The penny has just dropped, the Robert Fewell, husband of Marie Boughtell, is probably the son of Robert Fewell Clergyman, that Robert Fewell being a Clergyman in 1558 it would be around the time, or perhaps a few years earlier, when Marie's husband Robert was born, they married in 1581 at Withersfield.
 
I had another goolge on Giles Fewell, Withersfield, Fewells in Essex-Essex-UK-Rootsweb came up but when I went into it It was a load of mishmash and I couldnt go any further to get an answer. However it does say that "Robart Fewell was the vicar of Withersfield in Suffolk, just over the Essex border, 1558-1584. He had a son Giles from whom a line descended that migrated via Thaxted to Takeley"......this was dated 2001 and I cant get past this to find out more.
All of the above will either help or hinder.....:nailbiting:
 
Clergymen in those days were often graduates of Oxford or Cambridge, and since it's nearer I thought I'd try looking at the Cambridge Alumni database at
Code: 
http://venn.lib.cam.ac.uk/Documents/acad/2018/search-2018.html
There's an entry for Robert FEWELL as mentioned by Sue, and two separate Robert FOWLEs. It might be worth looking for others in the family too.

Where a college is named (it isn't always) it can also be useful to see if that has its own archives. And bear in mind that clergy often left wills, so that would be something else to follow up.
 
Just popped in to say thanks to Sue and Arthur for those great pieces of info.

Sue, that Google of yours has reinforced my take of how the line went i.e. Withersfield, Suffolk to Thaxted Essex, then to Takeley and other parts thereafter. It was Daniel the son of Giles who took the line to Takeley (unless Giles went there first), Daniel Fewell married Sara Wood at Thaxted in 1669 and baptised six children 1672 to 1695 at Takeley.

I have to confess I didn't think to Google the Fewell family, never dreamt there would be anything like that recorded, guess I'll have to become a bit more imaginative.

The spell checker is telling me dreamt is not spelled correctly or not a real word whatever!

Well perhaps I'll continue on for a while, I think there's one or two things I can check.
 
I've book marked the Cambridge Uni site you gave the link to.

How would I go about looking to see if Robert left a will, which no doubt would be in Suffolk, any ideas?

It wouldn't concern me to have to take out a sub for a small period at some site, I was thinking it might lead to finding out other children names.
 
At that time Suffolk was in the Diocese of Norwich, so it's worth looking in the Norfolk Archives catalogue for wills:
Code: 
http://nrocat.norfolk.gov.uk/DServe/public/searches/nroprobate.htm
There are a number for Fowell and Fowle, some of which specifically mention Suffolk, but I'll leave you to see if they're relevant.

Once you've found an entry there you need to locate the will. A lot of them are online at FamilySearch, but when I've looked there before the images for some courts have been locked for some reason. It can be a bit tedious matching up the reference numbers with the contents of the films, and then you have to work your way through manually till you find the right document, but I've always got there in the end.

To help you find the right set of images, see the following link. (I've added the one for Suffolk in case that's useful to you too.)
Code: 
https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Norfolk_Probate_Records

https://www.familysearch.org/wiki/en/Suffolk_Probate_Records

It's a while since I looked at these so I'm a bit rusty on exactly how to do it, but hopefully this might get you somewhere.
 
I believe the locked records are available to view at a Mormon Library,
however that may be difficult at the moment!
The one and only Will I have of Suffolk, I found notice of in a properly
researched article on Google. I 'phoned Suffolk Archives and it took them
a few minutes to locate it, because of the spelling, but I then paid them by
card and it was e-mailed to me within 24 hours! It was for around 1590
and proved extremely useful as it named the lady's nephew, my direct
ancestor and so proved the line hinted at in several other references.
 
Thanks for that Jan, had a look but nothing came up, maybe I need to try again perhaps there's something else to try..
 
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