The mother of Ann Young.

Ann Young was the last child born to John Young and his wife Mary in 3rd q 1841 in Reading, Berkshire. According to GRO the only Ann Young born in Reading in 1841 was vol. 06 page 205 with MMN as STOPP.

Most trees that I can see has the mother MMN as Godman. All of John's children [from Thomas [1822] to Jane [1837] were baptised and the mother was Mary.

I can't find a marriage of John Young to a Mary STOPP or GODMAN - please help

 

Not having any luck here either Colin. tried Anc. & Family Search. The only close one is for a Mary Goodman

 

Not having any luck here either Colin. tried Anc. & Family Search. The only close one is for a Mary Goodman 1835 Westminster & a James Young & Mary Godman. which I have since misplaced
A couple of deaths for a Mary Young in case John married twice.

sorry called away before I could finish the edit.

 

Just to start with....

Ann Young was baptised 8th August 1841 at St Giles, Reading, Berkshire. Her parents were John Young, a Gardener who lived at Cave's Court, Crown Street, Reading, Berkshire and his wife Mary Young (transcription from FMP, no original image).

 

The same family are in the 1841 census a few months before Ann's birth, living at Crown Street Cave Court, St Giles, Reading.

The family comprises:
John Young 40-44, a Gardener, his wife Mary Young 40-44 and their children Alfred Young 14, Eliza Young 10 and William Young 8. All persons born Berkshire.

So now we know his wife Mary was born circa 1796-1801 in Berkshire and that she married John Young most probably in the period 1814-1822, assuming she had no children out of wedlock.

 

Hmm, a John Young marries Mary Ann Criswick on 27th September 1816 in Wiltshire, Berkshire. Mary was born in 1897 and her father was Robert Criswick. Seems like she is a good possibility. Now to check the 1851 census.....

... hmm, no match for Mary in the 1851 Berkshire census, so we will have to cast the net a bit wider to find her so we can confirm the 1816 marriage is a match.

 

Spotted that one too but the other surnames put me off. Perfect age though.

 

In the 1851 census there is a John Young, a Gardener, 55 born Sonning, Berkshire married to a Mary.... but she is shown as age 57 and born Brightnell, Oxfordshire. They have a 9 year old daughter Ann, born Reading, Berkshire and are living at Silver St, Reading, St Giles, Berkshire. So close, but not quite a match on Mary's age and birthplace if the 1841 and 1851 census are accurate and if she was a Criswick.

No match in Berkshire in the 1861 census for Mary Ann Criswick. Time to investigate the other surname options Stopp, Goodman or Godman...

 

In FMP there are no parish marriage matches anywhere in the UK for a Mary Stopp to a John Young.
In FMP there are no parish marriage matches anywhere in Berkshire for a Mary Godman or Mary Goodman to a John Young either.
Beginning to wonder if Stopp, Godman/Goodman are false leads????

 

Or if indeed they even married.

 

Did she marry Joseph Ackerman?

 

Back to first principles, the children of John Young and Mary (who all were christened as St Giles, Reading, Berkshire) seem to be:

1) Thomas baptised 31st March 1822
2) Susan baptised 18th August 1824
3) Alfred baptised 27th August 1826
4) William baptised 24th March 1833
5) Mary Anne baptised 3rd January 1836
6) Jane baptsied 5th March 1837 and
7) Ann baptised 8th August 1841

The naming of Mary Anne is interesting, perhaps named after her mother, if her mother was Mary Ann Criswick???? The age of Ann is a match to the 1851 census too, but if so, where are the other children??? The ages of Arthur 14 and William 8 are a match in the 1841 census, but that also suggests an extra child Eliza Young age 10 should be in this baptism list, born circa 1830-1831.

A John Young and Mary had two children who were baptised in Chosley, Berkshire:
1) Emma born 1832, baptised 1842 and
2) Charlotte born 1835, baptised 1842

Need to check if they are a different couple though, since the baptism place is different.

 

Here we go, the missing baptism is (from FMP transcription):

Eliza Young, baptised 21-03-1830 at St Giles, Reading, Berkshire. Daughter of John Young of Crown St, Labourer and Marianne Young.

Getting back to the original question, I think that suggests that the mother of Eliza's sibling, Ann Young, 3rd quarter of 1841 is Mary Ann Young nee Criswick, unless that is another family and another Ann Young altogether, both in Reading, Berkshire, in which case.....????

 

Back to first principles again, a search of the GRO for the 3rd quarter in Reading shows only 1 result (as stated at the the start of the thread). So that is a puzzle, since I think that I've shown the 1841 baptism at St Giles is either not the person in the GRO record below.... or the mother's surname in the BRO is a mistake. Got to be one of those 2 options, which seemingly doesn't get us any closer to identifying who the mother was, if the mother's name really was STOPP, rather than Criswick. Over to someone else to have a go......as that would beg the question, why aren't there 2 registrations for Ann Young in 1841, one with mother's name CRISWICK, the other as STOPP??

YOUNG, ANN STOPP
GRO Reference: 1841 S Quarter in READING Volume 06 Page 205

A further check of the GRO does not reveal any birth records for birth name YOUNG and mother's name CRISWICK (nb: the earlier children were born before the start of the GRO records), suggesting that either way, Ann Young was the last child born.

 

After that detour.....back to first principles again, was there a Mary Stopp?

In FMP there is a Mary Stopp born 1800, in Brightwell Baldwin, Oxford, Oxfordshire whose father was William Stopp. Baptism year is not stated.

This person is a place match to the 1851 census, as on re-reading the handwriting, her birthplace is Brightwell, Oxfordshire not Brightnell. The handwritten age is clearly 57, but if that was actually meant to be 51 it would also be a match to this person, along with an age match to the daughter being Ann Young 9 and the husband being John Young (the 1851 census shows Mary and John as being married).

There is also a Mary Ann Stopp born 2nd May 1807, baptised 30-05-1807 at St George Hanover Square, parents Joseph and Mary.

So yes, there was a potential Mary Stopp and if so, I'd favour her being the one born in 1800, but it still needs more work to prove it (you'd need to examine the census records involving her potential children). Now we also need to see if there was a Mary STOPP marriage before 1851, otherwise the 1807 Mary Stopp may have not married (old enough to give birth to Thomas in 1822, but too young to marry at that time).

 

There is a marriage at Brightwell Baldwin Oxfordshire

Anc Transcription - Mary StAppe married John Young 9/7/1821

 

The puzzle continues. I can't find an FMP marriage match (either GRO or parish) for a John Young and Mary Stopp in the period 1815 to 1895. So that doesn't help resolve which Mary Stopp, if either, we are after. No marriage matches at all in freereg either. Conclusion: if her maiden name was STOPP, the 1851 census Mary STOPP married John Young prior to Sep 1837 (but there was no parish marriage record) and the 1807 Mary STOPP either didn't marry at all, or she also married before Sep 1837 (but there also was no parish marriage record in her case). I'd suggest tracking the children in the 1841, 1851 and 1861 census may be the only way to settle this (this puzzle has been quite interesting but unfortunately I don't have any more time to spend on it at the moment).

Hope this has been of some help to you, Artful Dodger. Good luck.

 

Great find Molly May, you posted just before I'd sent my previous, still puzzled post.

You could interpret that marriage certificate as being a different spelling of Stopp and it would then be a great match to the 1851 census couple, suggesting that the mother of Ann Young is indeed Mary Stopp, born circa 1800 in Brightwell, Baldwin, Oxfordshire.

I think there's a good chance you've solved it Molly May, so long as the census follow up of the children verifies it. The marriage date the year before Thomas Young is born is also a great, logical fit and would seem to rule out the 1807 Mary Stopp.

 

I thnk one of the witnesses is Richard Stoppe which might help tie down the Stoppe family.

I couldn't make out the word before Batchelor in John Youngs entry - it could be his place of residence

 

'Edit' would not let me add an enlarged snip



Maple Durham perhaps