Another St. Patrick's Day ---

Discussion in 'County Down' started by The Artful Dodger, Mar 17, 2014.

  1. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

    Offline
    Messages:
    4,098
    Likes Received:
    3,438
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    and my wife - 1/3 Irish, 1/3 Austrian and 1/3 Welsh - always asks me what I've discovered on her ancestry.

    He maiden name was JONES and that, in comparison has been fairly easy.

    wasSince last March 17, we have 'discovered' who we 'think' is her maternal grandmother's family.

    If I post details can anyone take a 'stab' at going back?
     
  2. LianeH

    LianeH Well-Known Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    703
    Likes Received:
    6,761
    Location:
    Derbyshire ex Chelmsford
    You like to give us a challenge Colin, post away and we'll see what we can come up with.

    By the way hope you're sitting at home with a beer or three x
     
    arryboy and mugwortismy cat like this.
  3. arthurk

    arthurk Well-Known Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    798
    Likes Received:
    2,840
    Location:
    Cheshire, England
    :confused: You've already given me a challenge, Colin, trying to work out how Mrs Dodger's ancestry is measured in thirds, when mine is in halves, quarters, eighths etc, on the basis of there being two parents at each generation.

    Or are you saying that she was, for example, born in Ireland to parents from Austria and Wales?
     
  4. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

    Offline
    Messages:
    4,098
    Likes Received:
    3,438
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    At your urging, Liane, here is what [amongst other things] we have about my wife's maternal grandmother:
    Name: Mary Ellen Mccusker
    Gender: Female
    Birth Date: 30 Jan. 1880
    Birth Place: Druero & Drumero, Down, Ireland
    Father's name: Thomas Mccusker
    Mother's name: Matilde Mccusker Deolin
    FHL Film Number: 256043.

    Source: Ireland, Select Births and Baptisms, 1620-1911. This is a transcription from Ancestry. There is no image available to viw. We suspect that the mother's maiden name is Devlin rather than Deolin.

    A cousin of my wife thinks Mary Ellen was baptised in Maghelarin, Co. Down.

    1901 census for Ireland:
    Living in Bottier, Moira, Down, Ireland:
    Thomas age 46
    Matilda age 45
    2 daughters:
    Margaret J. age 9
    Matilda C. age 3
    and
    5 sons:
    Thomas P. age 2
    Joseph age 7
    James age 11
    William Patrick age 19
    John E. age 17.

    Source: Web., Ireland, 1901 Census.

    Mary Ellen is not with this family as she is working as a Hotel Servant in Dublin and was to marry on 25 December 1901

    We have found Thomas and Matilda in 1911 census, living at Haypark Avenue, Ormeau, Down, Ireland. They have 4 sons - all with what we believe are their now Irish given names
    Thomas P.? - now age 11 and transcribed as Philb Mac Oscair
    Joseph? - now age 17 and transcribed as Joseph Mac Oscair
    John E? - now age 27 and transcribed Seaghan Mac Oscair
    William Patrick? - now age 29 and transcribed as Liam Padraig Mac Oscair.
    and another son:
    Seamus - age 20

    The daughters:
    Margaret - now age 18, Matilda - now age 13 both transctibe as McCuscar. They've also added - Elizabeth age 24, Annie age 23 and Margaret age 18.
    We feel this is the right family but are not 100%
     
  5. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

    Offline
    Messages:
    4,098
    Likes Received:
    3,438
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    I was beside myself - too much Guinness. My wife is 1/2 Welsh - father Jones and 1/4 Austrian - grandfather - Darrer & 1/4 Irish grandmother -McCusker.

    Hope I'm right now - hic.

    I knew there was something 'different' about my wife! and she still loves me - the $64.00 question is --- WHY?
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2014
    Bay Horse, Ma-dotcom, she04 and 4 others like this.
  6. AmesMH

    AmesMH New Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    14
    Location:
    London
    OH COLIN!
    Thank goodness I found you! I'm tracing the same family history. My mum is on the Darrer side and everytime I get stuck with it, I google and find that you've become stuck at the same points!
    So Ferdinand Darrer was my Great Great Grandfather. I'm hoping you can help me now! So I have the 1911 census of Ferdinand Darrer's family which I know to be right and then further back I have the 1901 (and 1911) Thomas McCusker Census. I can't for the life of me figure out why Mary Ellen doesnt appear and who the extra sets of names are? Did you ever find an answer?
    Amy :)



     
  7. patten-walsh

    patten-walsh Well-Known Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    946
    Location:
    Romford,Essex
    Well Amy I did take a stab at it and ran up a rough tree to help Colin at the time.
    I still have that tree on the computer and could help you a bit, the only sticking bit is the Darrer connection.
    All that is known is that Ferdinand Darrer b.1870 in Austria married at Holy Rosary RC Chapel, Belfast, Co.Antrim, Ireland to Mary Ellen McCusker.
    In 1911 they are living at 49,Candahar St,Ormeau,Co.Down,Ireland and Ferdinand dies 11 Jan 1944 at 74,Brunswick Rd,Bangor,Co.Down,Ireland

    If you can elaborate on the Darrer side of the family I may then be able to progress the tree on that side.
     
    The Artful Dodger and Sis like this.
  8. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

    Offline
    Messages:
    4,098
    Likes Received:
    3,438
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Welcome, Amy. The Darrer's have been a real stumbling block and to a lesser degree so have the McCusker's.

    As some of you may have been aware my health has not been good for several years now and consequently have done little if anything on this branch.

    Other members of the Darrer family have concluded that although Ferdinand named his father as Ferdinand - a Farmer by occupation, he was in fact illegitimate and that his mother was named Teresa who was unmarried. We know that he was born in Austria c. 1871 we have not been able to trace a birth certificate.
    It is not known exactly how or when he arrived in Ireland as the the 1901 census is the earliest trace found.
    His occupation as a General Domestic Servant in a hotel in Belfast is likely just a 'start-up' as he seems to have been a well educated man as he could read and write in 3 languages - English, French and German.

    He and Mary Ellen McCusker had 7 children - 1 died in infancy and another at age 3. My wife is descended from their youngest daughter Josephine Patricia.
     
  9. patten-walsh

    patten-walsh Well-Known Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    946
    Location:
    Romford,Essex
    Hi Colin ,
    Very nice to hear from you again, and I have from the forum, known that you have not been in the best of health for some time.

    Hopefully things will improve for you.

    Ferdinand was born 12 Jan 1871 in Vienna according to the attached
     

    Attached Files:

    Sis, Ma-dotcom and The Artful Dodger like this.
  10. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

    Offline
    Messages:
    4,098
    Likes Received:
    3,438
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Not so far, but I live in hope.
     
    patten-walsh, AnnB, Half Hour and 3 others like this.
  11. AmesMH

    AmesMH New Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    14
    Location:
    London
    Hello everyone! Oh well in that case, I may be of help. My mum has a copy of Ferdinand's birth certificate (so she says!). As soon as I have it, I'll share it! I believe he's buried in Bangor but I can't seem to find anything online. I think that's right about the 'start up' job though because we've found a photo and he's very well dressed for the time so that did make me question his family in Austria. I haven't really come across any Darrer's but lots of Dorrer's? Hopefully this birth certificate will give us a new lead
    I have to say I think its really lovely that everyone is so helpful on the forum and keen to support each other. You don't feel silly to make a guess or ask a question and I think that's really so nice :)
     
    patten-walsh, Half Hour, AnnB and 5 others like this.
  12. patten-walsh

    patten-walsh Well-Known Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    946
    Location:
    Romford,Essex
    So Amy, if Ferdinand Darrer is you Great Great Grandfather who was you Grandfather on that line of the family ?
    This will help put some pieces in place
     
  13. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

    Offline
    Messages:
    4,098
    Likes Received:
    3,438
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    And me as well!!
    I have the 5 children of Ferdinand and Mary Ellen that survived childhood. According to my research, the children were:
    Mary Ellen born 1902 married Thomas Albert Crawley
    Ferdinand Alphonsus born 1906 married Mary Elizabeth Gordon
    William Desmond born 1908 married Patricia Josephine Murphy
    Joseph Gerald born 1913 married Mary or Maureen unknown. She may have died Belfast 2004
    Josephine Patricia born 1918 married Ronald James Jones.
     
    patten-walsh likes this.
  14. patten-walsh

    patten-walsh Well-Known Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    946
    Location:
    Romford,Essex
    Yes all those marriages are correct.
    Joseph Gerald married Mary Maureen Moore 18 Apr 1938 Belfast Registars Office.
     
    The Artful Dodger likes this.
  15. AmesMH

    AmesMH New Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    3
    Likes Received:
    14
    Location:
    London
    So Ferdinand Alphonsus (known as Jack) married Elizabeth Gordon (known as Millie). They had a number of children and one of them John Gordon Darrer was my grandfather. For some reason in our family on the Darrer side, everyone up to my generation was know by their second name. Which does make things tricky! I haven't captured them all but I've made a good go of it and I'm still adding! I've attached a clip below if that's helpful. Eva Rose is the very most up to date member having been born in Dec 18. I really feel like I must know more about the Austrian side, I've really been focused on Ferdinand and I wish I could find more about him. I know his father was also a Ferdinand Darrer and I believe it was a military birth but records are so hard to find. I'm still chasing this birth certificate!
     

    Attached Files:

    The Artful Dodger likes this.
  16. patten-walsh

    patten-walsh Well-Known Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    482
    Likes Received:
    946
    Location:
    Romford,Essex
    Thanks Amy, i'm sure Colin, The Artful Dodger, will be pleased to see some more relatives of his wife although sadly the beginnings of Ferdinand Darrer 1871 may never be solved. His death was at 74, Brunswick Rd, Bangor, Co.Down, Ireland but cannot find burial place from the records that are available.
     
    The Artful Dodger likes this.
  17. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

    Offline
    Messages:
    4,098
    Likes Received:
    3,438
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    Hello Amy.
    You mentioned in post #15 you are adding family members to John Gordon and and his wife.
    You mention that her name was Nora Marie Healy. I have a birth in Cork in 1933 but it shows a registration as Marie T. Healy so am hoping you can provie a confirmation of her name. Do you have their marriage cert. as all I know is that it was in Cork possibly 1960?
    They moved to Hendon and had 6 children [your mother was their 2nd].

    So far it would appear from your post you have John Gordon having 3 siblings - Brian, Malcolm and Claire. Brian is Edward Brian, Malcolm is Frederick Malcolm and Claire is Mary Claire according to my research. I also have 7 other siblings. Do you have these folks or do you want me to list what I have?
     
  18. Daft Bat

    Daft Bat Administrator. Chief cook & bottle washer! Staff Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    5,397
    Likes Received:
    20,992
    Location:
    Northamptonshire, England.
    Please be mindful of posting details of living or potentially living people.

    Thanks. :)
     
    The Artful Dodger likes this.
  19. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

    Offline
    Messages:
    4,098
    Likes Received:
    3,438
    Location:
    Ontario, Canada
    I will.. if Amy wants the details of those other than the ones in her 'clip' on post #15, I'll do it privately.
     
    Daft Bat likes this.
  20. Daft Bat

    Daft Bat Administrator. Chief cook & bottle washer! Staff Member

    Offline
    Messages:
    5,397
    Likes Received:
    20,992
    Location:
    Northamptonshire, England.
    Thank you. :)
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice