Can I ask for a burial look up?

Discussion in 'Church Records' started by The Artful Dodger, Jun 29, 2014.

  1. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    James and Jane Golly - nee Harris - were married in Gorran, Cornwall, 4 November 1701. They baptised a daughter named Jane, 26 December 1705. It seems most likely that this daughter died as they baptised another daughter as Jane, 9 April 1711.

    The burial records for Gorran - name Golly - do not appear to have been transcribed prior to 1762. And nothing shows up on various searches on Ancestry.

    This would be most appreciated - thank you!!
     
  2. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    According to a few enquiries and a tree ( Crawford & Dry) James Golly born 1674 Gorran, father John + Jane Harris born 1672.
    James died in 1737, no not where but in Cornwall.
    Children were, James 1707, Senoby 1703, Dunes 1701, Jane 1711, Jane 1705,
    John 1715 and Mary 1712.
    That'll give ya something to work on :)
    Looks like some of their descendants live in Victoria, Australia
     
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  3. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    Hi Archie's Mum.
    I had the baptisms of 5 of the 7 named above. Thank you for providing the others.

    Obviously I have lots to do but I can tell you:
    Senoby m. William Teague 22 May 1727
    James - my 6X gt.-grandfather m. Margery Remmett [Reymatt] 31 August 1732 and was buried 29 August 1772.

    Still, I would like to find the burial for Jane - bapt. 26 December 1705, in order to sort of confirm the one on 9 April 1711.
     
  4. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    James was bapt. in Gorran 14 January 1673 and Jane - his future bride - was bapt. 15 September 1672 - also in Gorran

    I've just been sent 'stuff' pertaining to the deaths of some Golly's that have a bearing on this family, but I don't understand it completely.

    May I post my transcripts of the transcripts sent to me?
     
  5. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    Post away, but we are just going out the door for more eye surgery, so I will be missing until late today.
    So I will catch up on what you send later:(
     
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  6. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    9.35pm - Sunday - and I am busy transcribing stuff that won't print properly. Dates of stuff are 1681 and newer so it'll be tomorrow morning - my time - before I finish.
     
  7. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    Finished transcribing and ready to post - Doc.'s #1 & 2 relate to leases and doc. #3 is a will.

    Document #1
    Ref. # - EL/17/19
    Title: Lease for 99 years or one life, Rice and Lamledra in Gorran
    Date : 25 January 1681
    Format: Manuscript
    Extant: 1 piece
    Description: - Parties: 1] John Eliot, esquire of Port Eliot: 2] John Golly, husbandman of Gorran.
    Two fields or closes of land called Scawe Park and Little Meadow and the moiety of another field called Parktudson being parts of Rice and Lamledra in Gorran. Term 99 years or the life of Duance Golly, wife of 2].
    Consideration: 35 pounds and rent of 3 shillings per annum, one capon at Michaelmas or 12 pence and one harvest journey or 4 pence.

    Heriot: 10 shillings.

    Document #2
    Ref. # - EL/18/12
    Title: Lease for 99 years or life, Lamledra in Gorran
    Date: 21 May 1706
    Format: Manuscript
    Extant: 1 Piece
    Description: - Parties: 1] John Speccott, esquire of Penhale, Samuel Rolle, esquire of Heanton in Devon and Johnathan Sparks of Plymouth; John Rashleigh, esquire of Corner Hall in Hertford; William Hancock, esquire of Hendra - trustees of the will of Daniell Eliot, esquire of Port Eliot.
    2] John Golly the younger, yeoman of Gorran.
    Two little dwelling houses and the outhouses and gardens, and one close of land lying on the south side of the lane leading from Gorran Haven to Lamledra, now in the possession of 2] and formerly leased by Thomas Hanslowe, esquire to John Golly, the father of 2].
    Term: 99 years or the life of Margaret Vercoe, daughter of Edward Vercoe of Gorran, yeoman, to commence upon the death of John Golly senior and Edward his brother.
    Consideration: 10 shillings and rent of 6s.11d. per annum, plus one harvest journey or 3d. and one capon or 6d. at Christmas.

    Heriot: One half of the best beast.

    I'll post the will later but I have questions about the above 2 leases which I believe are part of the Eliot family, Earls of St. Germans.

    For starters:
    Q. #1 - What is a Heriot? I did get an explanation by Mr. Google but it seemed not to relate to leases of property.

    Q. #2 - I was surprised at terms of Consideration between the lease of 1681 and the one in 1706. If this was an amount that was paid at the commencement of the lease then the John Golly in 1681 was married, aged 34 and had 4 children, then I wonder how he got the 35 pounds which 300+ years ago would have been difficult to raise. Were the terms reasonable in the opinions of the forum?
     
  8. AnnB

    AnnB Editor in Chief who is Hot off the Press!

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    Heriot - a payment, usually of the best beast, which was due to the lord on the death of a tenant

    Ann
     
  9. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    Thank you, Ann
     
  10. AnnB

    AnnB Editor in Chief who is Hot off the Press!

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    No problem Colin :)

    I've just been rummaging around the Interwebby - I don't know if you've seen this web site or come across the fellow who has compiled it, but you seem to be researching the same Gollys - djwiseman.co.uk/golly-family-history.html

    He has Jane Golly, born about 1705, died Mar 1706

    Ann
     
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  11. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    Thank you again, Ann.

    I hadn't come across this site before so paid a visit and ultimately sent an email. The chart has John & Duens as 7X gt.grandparents to dj, whereas they are my 8X.

    Be interesting to see what transpires.
     
  12. AnnB

    AnnB Editor in Chief who is Hot off the Press!

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    I thought you might get in touch if you hadn't seen the site before - fingers crossed :)

    Ann
     
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  13. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    We share back to dj's 5X gt.- grandparents and then a lady Golly married whereas in mine it is all male Golly/Golley's right up to the the birth of my mother on 29 June 1921.
     
  14. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    My 1st question has been resolved.

    But I am still having difficulty with the Terms of Consideration between the 2 leases. Maybe I am missing a vital piece between 1681 & 1706 - but what?
     
  15. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    I wonder - could John Golly have purchased the 2 little houses and outhouses [1681 lease]?

    This 'sort of' fits to the will of Duens/Duance in late 1720's but there is also some confusion there which I hope to resolve by contacting various tree owners.

     
  16. Huncamunca

    Huncamunca The Knowledgeable One

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    I am not sure what the difficulty is: from the descriptions (and the fact that the catalogue numbers aren't consecutive), the two leases seem to relate to different properties so it might not be surprising if the terms were different. If you can identify the source of these catalogue entries (perhaps the CRO catalogue? or A2A?) you might be able to find other leases in each sequence to make more sense of things.

    Re. the difference in 'consideration', I don't know how it worked, but wonder if the lessee could get together a bigger initial down-payment, might they be able to negotiate a lower annual rent?

    There's some discussion here of leases for lives, which might be of interest:

    http://
    archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/DEVON/2010-12/1292931789

    P.S. it seems that the entries are from the CRO online catalogue.
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2014
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  17. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    All over my head, being the simple person that I am. ;) but interesting none the less. Will absorb after the cobwebs clear.......:rolleyes:
     
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  18. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    Still making a little headway but some pieces of the family puzzle are now filling in.

    Note that in the 2nd Lease - 21 May 1706 - which mentions John Golly the younger taking over the leases upon the deaths of John Golly [the elder] and Edward [the brother of John the elder], I have now found Edward - at least the middle of his life.

    I suspect that he was born a couple of years prior to John - so possible baptism for him c. 1648. This has yet to be found.

    He baptised 7 children between 1669 & 1684 - 5 daughters and 2 sons. One son - Thomas - was buried 7 Jan 1678. The mother's name was Frances - but I have yet to find a record of the marriage.

    It is possible his wife Frances died prior to 1706 - but I have yet to find a burial. The reason that I think her death is a possibility is a Lease to Edward Golly dated 21 May 1706 - EL/18/14 - to be for 99 years or one life [son Edward Golly the younger].

    I have yet to find a burial for Edward Golly the elder.

    Help with these questions would be much appreciated.
     
  19. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    Once again you have pointed me in the right direction and I am finding lots of interesting stuff relating to leases involving the Golly family.
     
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  20. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    I can't believe it!!!! A lease dated 20 April 1652 - EL/17/11 - names John Golly [husbandman] of Gorran. It names John's wife as Margaret and their 2 sons - John and Edward.
     

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