Help deciphering Baptism entry

Discussion in 'Ask The Experts' started by mugwortismy cat, Aug 9, 2013.

  1. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    Just want to check that I am not going off on some wild fight of fancy with this one. I need a bit of help with the following baptism entry:


    rose caroline.jpg


    it's the marginal annotation that is causing the greatest grief, although the second part of the mother's name (Nott?) is problematic along with the minister's name

    After a lot of staring I began to think that the marginal annotation reads: "Privately Baptized at Morlais Britany March 15th 1858"

    Now there is a place called Morlaix in Brttany, and I cannot find a registration for this child on FreeBMD. So far the only reference I have found for this family is for the father's death in 1865.

    So does it say Morlaix?
     
  2. Yeates

    Yeates Active Member

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    my eyes see 'Morlaix, Britany' [sic]
     
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  3. Bay Horse

    Bay Horse Can be a bit of a dark horse

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    I think so. The last letter does look like an 'x' to me.
     
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  4. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    Thank you both :),

    The problem was that I wasn't expecting a place in France, and kept trying to fit a Dorset placename onto those words. Now I know that it says "Morlaix" it seems entirely clear ...
     
  5. Yeates

    Yeates Active Member

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    Does not the private baptism suggest they were out of the country? Usually we think of a failing-to-thrive infant, but in this case they needed to wait until back in the home parish, maybe?---Yeates
     
  6. AnnB

    AnnB Editor in Chief who is Hot off the Press!

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    I agree with your reading of the marginal annotation. Looks like little Rosa was born and privately baptised in Morlaix and was then 'received' into whichever church the register is for, on the family's return to Blighty. Perhaps she was a poorly baby and they felt she should be baptised in France, in case she didn't make it home? I think the mother's maiden name is Nott.

    The only Morlais I can find is an iron age hill fort in Wales which now seems to be the home of a golf club........

    Ann

    Goodness, I didn't think I typed that slowly.......
     
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  7. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    I have been going through this baptismal register since 1813 and am now in 1860. Private baptisms have been in the main (to my mind ... I have not carried out any statistical analysis) for children born to the higher strata of society, i.e. those described as Yeoman, Esquire or Gentleman, and also Minister's children. The few that have been for Labourers and others I have put down to the failure to thrive scenario.

    This one was unusual in that the record here is for being "received into the Church", when the private baptism has taken place within the Parish the baptism is just entered into the register with a note that it was private.

    I don't know that the private baptism suggests that the family were abroad, in and of itself. But the fact that they had the child "received into the Church", in effect introducing it to the rest of the congregation does suggest to me that they were out of the parish.

    Also, given that the birth was not registered in the UK this would be her official 'proof of existence', if you like.
     
  8. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    Thanks Ann

    There are more than two years between the Private baptism and the "reception", so it looks as though the family were out of the country for some time
     
  9. arthurk

    arthurk Well-Known Member

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    I think the minister has signed "Wm M Smith Marriott, Off[iciating] Min[ister]".

    Your comment about Esquires etc got me wondering, so having discovered it was Sydling St Nicholas, I looked for that with Twisden (the surname), and got to this page: http://
    thepeerage.com/p4883.htm

    From this it appears that William Marriott Smith-Marriott had a daughter with Twisden as a middle name, so presumably there was some family connection. I didn't continue to look into what this was, but I did find references to Twisdens in Kent, who were Baronets of Bradbourne.

    Edit:
    See my next message!
     
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  10. Huncamunca

    Huncamunca The Knowledgeable One

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    Thomas Twisden Hodges seems to have got around a bit. The Times of 3 May 1856 in a notice about a Chancery case asks 'all persons who claim to be entitled to or interested in any encumbrance or encumbrances created by Thomas Twisden Hodges late of Sandgate, in the county of Kent, Esq., but now residing at Melbourne, in Australia' to 'prove their encumbrance or encumbrances' (whatever that means!) at the chamber of the Master of the Rolls by 2(3?) May 1856.

    There are some references to Thomas Twisden Hodges of St Kilda in Australian newspapers of the same sort of period, in financial difficulties. This ties in with this report from Jackson's Oxford Journal of 13 January 1855:

    'A Cambridge man, writing in the Cambridge Independent from Melbourne, says:- "Twisden Hodges, who was M.P. for Rye in two or three Parliaments, is keeping a public house here; a nephew of Dr. Whewell, Master of Trinity College, was walking the streets last week without a shoe to his foot, or a shilling in his pocket; and I can enumerate many instances of this kind. Gentlemen having left the University come to Melbourne to make a fortune, and in a few weeks are found on a heap of stones, studying stone-cracking.'​

    Sorry, I am getting a bit side-tracked now. :)
     
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  11. arthurk

    arthurk Well-Known Member

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    My mistake - I mistook Twisden for the surname, when of course it is Hodges.
     
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  12. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    Thank you ArthurK

    that is very interesting!
     
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  13. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    I think it is probably still a relevant comment that you made earlier, there seems to be a lot of interlinking of Ministers and Esquires etc. I think rural Dorset at the time was still pretty feudal! It might make an interesting study should I decide to do more than transcribe ...
     
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  14. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    Thank you Huncamunca

    Side-tracked is good!
     
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  15. Huncamunca

    Huncamunca The Knowledgeable One

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    A2A has a catalogue of papers of 'The Burra family of Rye' at the East Sussex Record Office. These include a cutting from The Sussex Express, Surrey Standard Mail, Hants and County Advertiser of 19 October 1876 'With an account of the marriage of Rose [sic] Caroline, daughter of Thomas Twisden-Hodges and Lady Nott of Oakleigh in Goudhurst and Henry John Peareth esq, son of William Peareth of Usworth House Durham and Cliffe House, Sandgate in Kent'

    It appears that his wife preferred her previous married name: the Spectator, 9 Dec. 1854, announces a marriage 'On the 16th September, at Melbourne, Twisden Hodges, Esq., to Rosa Willson Nott, widow of the late Major-General Sir William Nott, G.C.B.'

    (This is from the Spectator Archive website, which I only just found today! Will post a separate thing about it.)
     
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  16. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    wow Huncamunca

    This is really good stuff!

    If I decide to grow this project into a one-place study or similar, I am roping you in to help. OK?
     
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  17. Chimp

    Chimp Moderator & Cheeky Human IMP Staff Member

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    http://en.
    wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Twisden_Hodges

    (Note from Admin: Link edited as Wikipedia asks for donations)
     
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  18. AnnB

    AnnB Editor in Chief who is Hot off the Press!

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    OK so now I'm going off at a tangent (again)

    Thomas Twisden Hodges was the son of Thomas Law Hodges and there is a lengthy biography/career history of the latter at http://www.
    historyofparliamentonline.org/volume/1820-1832/member/hodges-thomas-1776-1857

    Probably of no use whatsoever but ......:rolleyes:

    Ann
     
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  19. Chimp

    Chimp Moderator & Cheeky Human IMP Staff Member

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    Sorry Admin :oops:
     
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  20. mugwortismy cat

    mugwortismy cat Tenacious to the End!

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    Thank you Ann

    he sounds like a good sort ...
     
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