Marriage by License--where to find

Discussion in 'Church Records' started by Ma-dotcom, Jun 10, 2015.

  1. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    I have a marriage for which I have tried to locate a record of the license, here:
    London and Surrey, Marriage Bonds and Allegations1597-1921
    and here:
    London, Crisp’s Marriage Licence Index1713-1892
    and here:
    London, Marriage Licences 1521-1869
    with no result.

    Edward MALE married Sarah COLDSTOCK or COULSTOCK (shown as Sarah Coldstream in listing)
    22 Aug 1766 at St. Mary Magdalene, Bermondsey
    Witnesses Sarah COULSTOCK and John Fellowes
    Source: London, England, Marriages and Banns, 1754-1921

    Can anyone offer another source for me to check please. I've spent way too much time on this but would like to end my misery in this unfinished search. :reading:

    Edwards surname is in various records shown as Male, Mael, Meal & probably others.
     
  2. Chimp

    Chimp Moderator & Cheeky Human IMP Staff Member

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    A very good question Ma, I would like to know the answer to Marriage Licences too. I know my parents were married by Licence too (although my father can't remember having to get one). Although, I think I know the reason why they needed one :D
     
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  3. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    In this case Chimp, I hope to get assurance that it was his first marriage before he married in 1783 my 4th G'Grandmother Catherine Houns whom I have yet to find the birth place of,-perhaps Europe- Germany.

    It all goes on & on doesn't it?
     
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  4. Joanne

    Joanne Well-Known Member

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    Just a stab in the dark,could the records be kept in a courthouse?
     
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  5. Blackmogs

    Blackmogs Moderator. General Dogs(cats)body. Staff Member

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    FMP has a transcript of the Licence. Just search on Coldstock and the year.
    Dioceses of the Province of Canterbury
    Record set Vicar General Marriage Licences. Society of Genealogists has them indexed by surname. they are £15 a shot! Blow that for a game of soldiers. Can you wait until I am in London next??
     
  6. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    {-(^^)-}
    You've done it again, thanks Pal. I did try her name perhaps not all variations.
    Certainly I can wait. sad I couldn't find it in his name to see what if any info is there. Bless your cotton socks Sue.
     
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  7. Blackmogs

    Blackmogs Moderator. General Dogs(cats)body. Staff Member

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    You help me far more than I ever manage to do for you. I have emailed SoG to see if they do members rates. If not next time I am up there I will go in and get it for you. xxxxx
     
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  8. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    Bless yo Love, too bad UK Cuz is off sauntering cowboy land in USA.
     
  9. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    Update: Moggsy, I think it would be a wasted trip to London for these records. Having found Edward also listed just entered as 'Male' I also saw:

    The index to the Vicar General Marriage Licences..etc
    These record are indexed by last name only and will give you the following information about your ancestor:

    Bride last name
    Groom last name
    Licence date


    So- no ages birthdates or anything which helps more so than their marriage in the Church records.:(
    Thank you again tho' for the offer.
    ():-)
     
  10. Blackmogs

    Blackmogs Moderator. General Dogs(cats)body. Staff Member

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    Well darlin' that is just the index. But I think if I go there I can ask for them to find the original. I will then either transcribe it or get a copy. They must have got the index from the originals. :)
     
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  11. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    o_O oh! another :confused: moment for me. That didn't occur- I just didn't want you making a side trip if no result. Perhaps a phone-call first will answer that query- re originals? I'll sit back then & take other mental wanderings meanwhile eh?
     
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  12. Blackmogs

    Blackmogs Moderator. General Dogs(cats)body. Staff Member

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    :) it depends on whether they will dig out the original when you are there. They are a bit weird there in my experience. Very very knowledgeable of course but..........
     
  13. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    Perhaps a 'knowledge overkill' makes the rest of us hard to live with, around, in spite of etc?

    Perhaps an email/phone-call will assist them in digging out the original by appointment?
     
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  14. Blackmogs

    Blackmogs Moderator. General Dogs(cats)body. Staff Member

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    I emailed them on the day we started this - no reply so far :(
     
  15. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    Not so bad for a very busy group Mogsy, Remember the usual 5-7 working days which some businesses hang on their site, This one may be extra busy ;)
    Just think, when they do answer it may be that they have found the right cell to uncover the buried treasure. :D
     
  16. Blackmogs

    Blackmogs Moderator. General Dogs(cats)body. Staff Member

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    ok ok I'll back off. We live in a world of instant communication Wedny, I forget to be nice when it is not instant :rolleyes:
     
  17. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    Sorry Love,didn't mean to sound admonishing, just didn't want you to feel less than the topnotch you is.
    Am going quietly into frets now on another unended story which had it's moment in these pages. Oh the 1840s were harsh here. :(

    Some things & people seemingly brushed aside & not worthy of note or remembrance!~sigh!
     
  18. Blackmogs

    Blackmogs Moderator. General Dogs(cats)body. Staff Member

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    I didn't take it wrong dear! But I am a bit quick to judge. So we will have the asnwer one way or another.
    {-(^^)-}
     
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  19. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    I can be so .[.I'm sure there is a polite word]...at times, re-the above, &
    This was staring me in the face but I saw it NOT! :oops:

    Edward Male
    Year 1779
    Court Surrey Archdeaconry Court
    Volume title Volume 40 Registered & unregistered Wills 1778-1800
    Abstract reference SW/40_79
    Contents SW/40_79
    Edward Male (X) cook of the good ship the Northampton, captain John Barford, commander 22 Oct 1768
    all to my wife Sarah Male of Jacob Street, Bermondsey, exec.
    Witnesses: John Ware (X); Robert Campbell in the Folly near Rotherhithe
    Proved: 21 Jul 1779 to Sarah Chipp wife of John Chipp formerly Sarah Male, relict and exec.
    [DW/PA/7/31 ff.53v-54r; DW/PA/5/1779/24] (died last Nov; late of Rotherhithe)
    File volume 40
    Record set Surrey & South London Will Abstracts, 1470-1856
    Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
    Subcategory Wills & probate
    .............
    1779 Sarah Male widow married John CHIPP widower.
    ....................

    I guess my Edward did NOT marry this lady. Had I not dabble into Family historian, I probably wouldn't have noticed this boo-boo for a loong time!
    :rolleyes: :(
    Now I must find a new 1st wife for Edward & no-one seems to want to relinquish him from their many records.
     
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  20. PeterG

    PeterG Well-Known Member

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    "These record are indexed by last name only and will give you the following information about your ancestor:
    Bride last name
    Groom last name
    Licence date"


    That's only the minimum information. In many cases the allegation will contain more.

    From the SoG advice : "Every Allegation gives the full names of both parties, their parish of residence, their current marital status - eg spinster, widower - and the names of the church or churches where the marriage may take place. Additionally the age of both parties is usually given, although it is often omitted in the case of widowers and widows"

    "They must have got the index from the originals"

    No. It was compiled from the calendar.

    Vicar General marriage allegations have been filmed by the Mormons and can be ordered in the usual way. The SoG has a copy available in the lower library.
     
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