Unfamiliar territory...both time and place

Discussion in 'Rutland' started by Stafford, Jun 22, 2013.

  1. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    Searching for the death of Catherine Hickson, wife of John, and a marriage between John Hickson and Ann in Rutlandshire circa 1775 - 1785.

    John and Catherine Hickson had 3 children:
    John, christened 17/4/1769 died sometime before 1774
    John, christened 28/3/1774, died 10/4/1836
    Richard, christened 28/3/1775

    John Hickson and Ann had (at least) three children:
    Job, christened 9/8/1785
    William, christened 19/6/1787
    George, christened 5/12/1791

    I would like to know if the two Johns are the same person.
     
  2. wendymac

    wendymac Well-Known Member

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    Hi,

    Do you know Catherine's maiden name and her date of birth?
    John's (Snr) date of birth? and Ann's maiden name and date of birth?

    Wendy:)
     
  3. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    Hi Wendy,

    I'm researching William Hickson, father of Anne Bullimore Hickson. Anne was born in 1811 in Melton Mowbray to William Hickson and Ann Hare. William married and worked as a shoemaker in Melton Mowbray.

    The 1841 census and a family notice for his death give his date of birth as 1784/5. The only information I have as to his place of birth is not in Leicestershire (1841 census). His widow Ann Hare was born in Grantham Lincolnshire. Initially I searched for William born in Grantham but a kindly researcher suggested William was born in Rutland (post #1) and was the son of John Hickson and Ann.

    Since posting I have received the following information indicating the two Johns were different people.
    John Hickson b.1747 m. Catherine Louth in 1768
    John Hickson b 1760 m. Ann (maiden name unknown)
    As yet I haven't been able to confirm this information.

    I am trying to eliminate or confirm William Hickson b in Rutland was/was not Anne Bullimore Hickson's father.
     
  4. Huncamunca

    Huncamunca The Knowledgeable One

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    It is often easier to rule someone out than rule them in. You may be able to show that the William baptised in Rutland (in the parish of Oakham according to FamilySearch) in 1787 died in infancy or stayed there and married someone else. You cannot rely on the very basic entries in FamilySearch to construct a family tree, but will have to track down transcripts or copies of parish registers. The baptism register might (for example) give occupations or abodes for the fathers, which might help you decide if there were one or two Johns.

    If you could find the John Hickson / Ann marriage, this should say whether he was a bachelor or widower. Have you investigated the Leicestershire & Rutland FHS publication list: they have parish register transcripts, burial indexes etc. for sale on CD:

    http://www.
    lrfhs.org.uk/onlinecdsales.htm

    However, if there is no evidence that your William came from Rutland, I would think it better to concentrate on looking for clues to his origins in later documents. For example, are there apprenticeship records? When and where did he marry Ann Hare? What does the marriage register say about where he was from? Have you identified the witnesses?
     
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  5. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    Gosh I do have a lot to learn! Once again thank you for your guidance. Where will I find apprenticeship records?

    So far, I have searched census records and am confident William and Ann Hickson are Anne Bullimore Hickson's parents. Anne's eldest son William Langham is living with widowed Ann Hickson in 1851. Anne's christening record on Familysearch names her parents as Ann Hare and William Hickson..

    The only evidence I have found of their marriage is on Ancestry - source Pallot's Marriage Index. Details on the entry are "William Hickson & Ann Hare, lic... 8 Apr" I'm assuming the 'lic... ' implies by licence? According to Ancestry the marriage took place in 1800. The entry is stamped in blue with Melton Mowbray Leicestershire and the year 1830 or 1850. The first record I can find for the birth of a child is in 1811.
     
  6. Huncamunca

    Huncamunca The Knowledgeable One

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    Definitely sounds like a marriage by licence, which means that as well as the actual marriage you may be able to find paperwork relating to the issue of the licence, which may hold extra clues.

    Licences were issued by various church courts. Google tells me that Leicestershire was in the diocese of Lincoln until 1837 so one place to look would be Lincolnshire diocesan records. Findmypast has some abstracts of marriage licence bonds for the Lincoln Consistory Court 1628-1837. Though they have described them as 'Lincolnshire Marriage Licence Bonds and Allegations' they sound from their description as if they cover the whole diocese of Lincoln. To make it even worse they have lumped these records in with parish records, when they aren't parish records at all.

    You can find the description of the records here:
    http://www.
    findmypast.co.uk/help-and-advice/knowledge-base/parish-records/marriages#lincolnshireMarriages

    Presumably you have to go into FMP's parish record collection bit to search them.

    FMP also have indexes to the Faculty Office and Vicar General marriage licence allegations:
    http://www.
    findmypast.co.uk/content/sog/faculty-vicar-general

    Again, misleadingly, I think you have to search these via the parish records collection.
     
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  7. Huncamunca

    Huncamunca The Knowledgeable One

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    Ah, it looks like the marriage was at Melton Mowbray in 1810. See this list, taken from the Phillimore transcript of marriages at Melton Mowbray:

    http://
    leicestershireparishrecords.blogspot.co.uk/2010/04/phillmores-marriages-melton-mowbray.html
     
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  8. Chimp

    Chimp Moderator & Cheeky Human IMP Staff Member

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    Yep FreReg have the marriage too


    Marriage: 08 Apr 1810, Melton Mowbray, Leicestershire
    Groom: William HICKSON
    Bride: Ann HARE
    Notes By Licence
     
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  9. Huncamunca

    Huncamunca The Knowledgeable One

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    Considering that William & Ann went on to have children called Thomas Smith Hickson and Ann Bullimore Hickson (according to FamilySearch), it may well be significant that a Thomas Smith and Ann Bullimore married at Melton Mowbray on 27 May 1792, by licence. From the same Phillimore transcript mentioned in post #7.

    I would recommend getting hold of copies of both entries from the original parish register (as well as trying to track down marriage licence bonds/allegations).
     
  10. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    Thank you. I will peruse these as soon as possible. A basic search on FMP has no matches.
     
  11. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    Thank you, I have been following this avenue as well. William Langham is living with Thomas and his wife Ann Smith in 1841 in Melton Mowbray. In 1851 Ann Hickson, widow, is living with Ann Smith, described as her cousin. I've been searching for a connection. Ann Smith was born in St James, London. Due to the age difference of the two women I'm wondering if she could be an aunt? (HO107/2091 f210 P12). I found the marriage. Bullimores were living in London at the time of her birth but also in Lincolnshire and Leicestershire so I have drawn a blank. Using Hugh Wallis's index of middle names I found a Thomas Bullimore Hare baptised in Lincolnshire in 1806. So the connection may be through the 'Hare' line. Many of the breakthroughs I've made in the Langham line are due to following middle names. One of the Langham children has the middle name Hickson.

    I haven't found a connection to the Smiths as yet.

    I'm also searching for Ann Smith's will. Since she was living on independent means I'm assuming she left one. She may have died in 1854. I'm wondering if she left her money to William, although he too left a very murky trail. William Langham was born in 1831 in Melton Mowbray. I've found him in 1841 and 1851 and again possibly in 1891 married and living in Crediton, Devon.

    Many thanks.
     
  12. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    There is this one,
    Letter of administration of Ann smith's effects of Sth Ferriby, Lincolnshire left to William Smith yeoman & Husband of Ann who died 28 Jan. 1828 at Sth.Ferriby. Effects under 20pounds.
    (I don't know where Sth Ferriby is)
     
  13. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Wendy,
    Not mine unfortunately. Mine was Thomas's widow and was still alive in 1851.
     
  14. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    Beg pardon Stafford, I was looking for a 1858 entry & somehow got lost. this is the one I wanted.:
    Ann Smith of Sibsey, Lincoln, Widow died 29 Dec. 1858 Will approved 26th Feb 1859 at Lincoln by oath of William Smith farmer of Sibsey- son of one of the executors.Nor so far from Melton Mowbray. Effects under 200pounds.

    Another in Feb 1858 for Ann who died in Dec 1857 Ann late of Loughborough. connected to Walpole Family. effects under 600 pounds.
     
  15. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    I've found William living in America. He appears to have married Elizabeth Francis Reader in 1854 in Melton Mowbray. (A certificate will confirm). He returned from America with his wife in Jan 1891 just before the census. There are still details to find but I'm happy now I have a trail to follow. So, back to the Hicksons, Bullimores, Hares and Smiths.
     
  16. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Wendy. I know there is a connection to Sibsey in Lincolnshire, just can't recall who and when. Will need to check my notes.

    Ann Smith was married to Thomas Smith, tailor. Thomas appears to have been well known in Melton Mowbray. He died in Feb 1848 and had quite a large funeral.
     
  17. Stafford

    Stafford Well-Known Member

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    Colin's recent post revived my interest in this family. If Ann Smith, formerly Bullimore, was born in St James. London, where would I begin searching? Google has brought up too many choices.
     
  18. The Artful Dodger

    The Artful Dodger Dodging, ducking and diving

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    See - I do have my uses, after all:).
     

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