Which Bride?

Discussion in 'British Census' started by Ma-dotcom, Apr 20, 2022.

  1. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    I have another 'small' dilemma.

    My 2nd Gt.Gt. Uncle Samuel Peters had 3 dtrs & a son. son's name was William b. 8 April 1827 Bermondsey.
    In my Legacy file I have him listed as being a bachelor- fellmonger- who married Margaret Doherty on 26 July 1862,Trinity church St. Mary Newington. She is listed as spinster- both full age. His Father Samuel Peters.leather dresser.(Samuel died 7 Aug. 1832)
    ...
    A website belonging to a 3cx1r-proven- has this William Peters married to an 'Emma'b. Horsleydown, b. 1826 d. 1880 Wandsworth.This group blends into another part of my family - that of the wife of my 2cx1r.

    I've spent the day trying to align these people in the same boxes, but am not doing so well, while it would be magic to have them so matched in, I'd rather they be correct.

    Can anyone please offer a solution?
    I won't post censuses as that I think will just mess about with real findings.


    ..............
     
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  2. Daft Bat

    Daft Bat Administrator. Chief cook & bottle washer! Staff Member

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    The Parish Register for William PETERS and Margaret DOHERTY is on Ancestry and backs up the information that you have in your Legacy file.

    Does this other tree indicate when the marriage between William and Emma took place?
     
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  3. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    No Jan, she appears to be a bit of a mystery as far as a marriage goes, I have spent the day on GRO & FREEBMD as well as censuses. Imagination can wreak miracles or havock, but as much a I'd like to accept , I have reservations which are holding me back from adding this to family files. No real eveidence either of birth dates. I can only find evidence of the first 4- lines in my post.
    Am now being called to bed, thank you Jan for reading & replying.
     
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  4. Londoner

    Londoner Will always roll up her sleeves and dig around

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    in the 1851 census William and Margaret have a daughter Emily, there is a burial for Emily Peters age 4 in 1852. also a possible burial for Margaret in 1858 but not in Bermondsey. ( all at ancestry) I havent found William after this yet.
    There are two possible William and Emma marriages, to Emma Laurence in 1846 and Emma Joyce in 1851, in both cases William has father William so not your William.
     
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  5. Bay Horse

    Bay Horse Can be a bit of a dark horse

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    I'm also going around in circles, Wendy - sorry.

    I can't find anything fitting the bill.
     
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  6. Andromeda

    Andromeda Well-Known Member

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    The only man I can see in 1861 with that name, age, birthplace & occupation is at Park Street, Bermondsey with wife Emma and children Anne 9 & Eliza 2.

    By 1871 they are at Barlow Street, St Mary Newington, and William's occupation is Skinner. They have additional daughters - Emma 10 & Margaret 7, but Anne is no longer with them.

    The age gap between Anne & Eliza suggests they may not have the same father, but for the other 3 girls the best I can find are these:

    PETERS, ELIZA mmn LAWRENCE GRO Reference: 1859 M Quarter in SAINT OLAVE SOUTHWARK Volume 01D Page 51

    PETERS, EMILY mmn LAWRENCE GRO Reference: 1861 J Quarter in SAINT MARY MAGDALEN BERMONDSEY, SURREY Volume

    PETERS, ELIZABETH MARGARET mmn LAWRENCE GRO Reference: 1863 D Quarter in ST GEORGE SOUTHWARK Volume 01D Page 126
     
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  7. Andromeda

    Andromeda Well-Known Member

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    Elizabeth Margaret Peters married in 1880 naming her father as William Peters deceased, skin dresser, so those do look like the correct birth registrations.
     
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  8. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    Thank you all for looking.
    @Andromeda, I found those also, Annie married Benjamin Cheesman in 1870 -father William, a skinner. Witnesses James & Elizabeth Cheesman.

    In 1881 Eliza is with her married sister Emily Gould, which is where my other family connection is. I did wonder if that is where the other person began their search & connected both families. RG11; Piece: 562; Folio: 50; Page: 36

    The Peters -Laurence marrriage must have been only civil as I cannot find one on Ancestry or F.Search.

    In searching for a 'Margaret' I also found a Margaret Selby - 1849 That William may have been the 'carpenter & Undertaker' I spotted, who in 1871 lived with an Elizabeth [Mother]? wrong age for my William's Mother.& had a child 'Samuel'.
    1841 the correct census is this one HO107; Piece: 1048; Book: 6; Enumeration District: 15; Folio: 16; Page: 26; Showing Elizabeth 44 William 13 & Elizabeth 16. Smith place, Bermondsey.
    I had copious notes from yesterday's searching but I think I must have deleted some after dismissing the connections. One of them showed William as a widower on census.

    I think I will include these as tentative correct family until I can prove better.
    They go with my Martin / Clark line.

    Again thank you very much for the help here.
     
  9. Jellylegs

    Jellylegs Well-Known Member

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    Wendy, they married on 7 June 1846 at Horne? in Surrey. William is listed as a Bricklayer - father also William and a Bricklayer. Witnesses were George and Harriet Humphrey. The certificate is on Ancestry.

    It looks as though Emma and the two witnesses "made their mark" and William signed.

    From memory, they were still together in 1891 - did look at it all earlier and started typing a reply, but got carried away doing household chores, so never finished typing it up :rolleyes:.
     
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  10. Jellylegs

    Jellylegs Well-Known Member

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    Emma is a widow in 1901 and I found a burial for her in 1904, Reigate, Surrey. Her address is the same as the 1901 census (transcribed as Emma Petres).
     
  11. Andromeda

    Andromeda Well-Known Member

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    That couple appear in Reigate at the same time that William the fellmonger/skinner is in Bermondsey/Newington with the 'other' Emma Lawrence.

    I'm completely flummoxed! It looks like your William either didn't marry Emma, or she'd been married previously so the marriage was under a different surname. Either that, or for some reason Emma Lawrence married as Margaret Doherty.

    I'm just glad it's not my family!
     
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  12. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    PETERS, Elizabeth Margaret mmn LAWRENCE GRO Reference: 1863 D Quarter in ST George SouthwarkVolume 01D Page 126

    This made bells ring as William married Margaret Doherty, 26 July 1862. His father was definitely Samuel Peters a leather dresser.
    William started as a fell monger & then became a skinner.

    Thank you Annie for the reminder, as I did wonder why he'd been in Horne, is that same as for 'Godstone'? then the 'bricklayer' turned me away. I know that people can be given the wrong father's name on the wedding day for several reasons but the occupation is way off as was the carpenter / Undertaker mentioned above.

    I guess I am back to wondering. :(
     
  13. Ma-dotcom

    Ma-dotcom A Bonza Little Digger!

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    @Andromeda, gee taa, I'm thinking I may also ignore that part of my Family. I know the Gould connection is correct, should have known having two connects to one family wa a bit rich. The person on website doesn't seem to know much about 'Emma' either.
    I'll stick with what I do know for now, ...Just spotted a new website with wife as Margaret Emma Peters (born Lawrence). May have to speak with some of these site owners & see if anyone knew a G'mother or such who actually remembered a definite name in thei line with factual evidence.

    Off I go again- wish me luck please. :)

    Oh dear, just had a good look at that site, all over the place, wil go & prep casserole for dinner.
     
    Last edited: Apr 21, 2022
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