William James Guy D'elsa

Discussion in 'General Family History Queries' started by Amle, May 19, 2019.

  1. Amle

    Amle Well-Known Member

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    It's not very clever is it?
     
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  2. Sis

    Sis Rootles out resources!

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    Registration Number Family Name Given Name(s) Date of Birth/ Age at Death
    1971/28994 D'Elsa William James Guy 75Y
    1886/2078 d'Elsa Harold von Brantenstein 6M
    2016/24335 D'Elsa Christopher Nicholas Guy 15 June 1937
     
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  3. Amle

    Amle Well-Known Member

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    I just thought I would update you all. This quest has been an amazing experience and apart from finding a long lost uncle I have learnt a lot and thought I would share some of it with you (although I know many will already know this).
    I was able to find full images free of charge (Family Search) for William and Sophie, their marriage was in Florida on 10th Nov 1921, so he did marry bigamously! I also found little Raydia's birth certificate in April 1922 and her mother Sophie's death certificate a few weeks later, that did mention the 'poison oak'. What a resource for free. Studying the ships passenger list where William brings baby Raydia back to the UK (I did wonder how he could have coped with a small baby), just above him on the list was a 55 year old spinster May Gardner who was a Norland nanny and children's nurse! All the information is overwhelming, when once we had only heard vague stories. I was always sad that the family didn't know what happened to Will, they wondered if he died in the earthquake. I guess at his third and fourth marriages to Edith, the family weren't told, they might have something to say (a widower whose father was now Max D'elsa)! Edith's relatives were witnesses though. Maybe William could never come back to the UK.
    Family history has changed a lot, somethings are for the better but I am very, mindfull, all this was not too long ago and could be intrusive for family. Is there too much information out there? What will they find out about us?
     
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  4. Amle

    Amle Well-Known Member

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    I am wondering if any of our friends in New Zealand and Australia can help me? After finding my long lost uncle I am really keen to trace his descendants or just find out what happened to his family. I have sorted out the first child Raydia born in Los Angeles but only have sketchy information about the other three.

    On William James Guy D'elsa death certificate in 1971 he states he has four children
    Female age 45 (thought to be Raydia) Female age 43 thought to be Edith, Male age 42 (thought to be Michael born in Camberwell), Male age 34 thought to be Nicholas.
    I know Raydia and Nicholas both died in New Zealand but it is the other two I am trying to work out. I can't find a birth for Edith at all. I feel she must have been born in New Zealand but there is just nothing about her. I think the 1971 death certificate indicates that the four were alive in 1971.
    With thanks Elizabeth
     
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  5. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    Not sure if we have found this earlier but there is a marriage of Michael Guy D'Elsa to Kay Elsie Power in NSW in 1949, then a death of Kathleen Elsie D'Elsa in NSW in 1965, I think this is Kay who married Michael.
    Nothing for Edith so far.
     
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  6. Amle

    Amle Well-Known Member

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    Thank you so much.
    I dont think we had that detail. I will look for family trees on Kathleen. You never know where the next clue lies:D
     
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  7. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    This is really strange. I was looking for Edith D'Elsa and came across Edith Emily Paul nee Holloway born in Hong Kong in 1915 and died in 2008. I know she is not the Edith you are after but I did stop and have a second look. What a coincidence.
     
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  8. Daft Bat

    Daft Bat Administrator. Chief cook & bottle washer! Staff Member

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    Gentle reminder - please do not post details of living or potentially living people on the forum.

    Thank you. :)
     
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  9. Amle

    Amle Well-Known Member

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    I have been told all the children have died but thank you and I will be mindful and reminders are always good gentle or otherwise.
     
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  10. Daft Bat

    Daft Bat Administrator. Chief cook & bottle washer! Staff Member

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    :)
     
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  11. Amle

    Amle Well-Known Member

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    This feels as though it could be an earlier child of Edith I wonder but then the 'nee Holloway' doesn't add up :confused:
     
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  12. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    Mentioned in the New Zealand Herald 5th July 1934 is an Edith D'Elsa as a player in the production 'Calais to Dover'. However if her then with a birth year of around 1928 (death certificate of her father) then she would have been around 6 years.
    Or is this Edith her mother?
     
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  13. Amle

    Amle Well-Known Member

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    Thank you
    My instinct is to think this is young Edith as I have seen a similar mention of her sister Raydia in a production around the same time.
     
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  14. demeler

    demeler Well-Known Member

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    Hi,

    Could your Edith be a Joan?

    There is a UK Outward Passenger List 8 Nov. 1929 from Southampton to Wellington, NZ on the ship Mataroa
    d'Elsa, Mrs. E., age 31, housewife
    d'Elsa, Joan, age 4
    d'Elsa, Michael, age 2
    The last address for them is 219 Holledale Rd, Nunhead, Surrey

    NZ Electoral Rolls 1946 Tamaki, Auckland
    Delsa.jpg
     
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  15. Amle

    Amle Well-Known Member

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    Wow what a find demeler, that is def. them. I haven't seen that before. When Edith left for New Zealand to return to the UK in 1927 (where she had Michael) she was alone. So where did 'Joan' /Edith come from?
    Edith senior originally left the UK on 15 Nov 1924. She was travelling with her husband William and step daughter Raydia. I wonder could Edith/Joan have been born on the ship, or on the stop over in Australia? If none of these it would be New Zealand? Then how did she get back to the UK?:confused:

    I am very pleased with this information thank you.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 28, 2019
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  16. demeler

    demeler Well-Known Member

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    Hi,

    Amle I have sent you a personal message.
     
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  17. demeler

    demeler Well-Known Member

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    Hi,

    Being mindful of possible living people, Joan with the 3 distinct first names
    appears on electoral lists from 1949 onwards in Auckland with the surname..... "from a nursery rhyme.....one two ?????? my shoe." :D
     
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  18. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    Composer David Andross Farquar..The Dominion Post 10 May 2007. Born Cambridge 5 April 1928 died 8 May 2007. Married first to Raydia Guy d'Elsa 1954 then another marriage .
    "David Farquar was one of New Zealand's most distinguished and productive composers and responsible for perhaps our most classical composition, the dances for the play 'Ring Round the Moon' commissioned by Richard Campion for the New Zealand Players production in 1953' pressreader.com Lots more about him on the mentioned site.
    Note: Richard Campion and wife Edith were the parents of the well known director of 'The Piano'
    In another obit Raydia is described as a well-known actor, painter, sculptor and poet. She died in 2001.
    He and Raydia had two children.
    He received a Companion of The Order of Merit in 2004 for his contribution to music in New Zealand.
    In 1962 he presented his piece 'A Unicorn for Christmas' to Queen Elizabeth during her tour of New Zealand.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2019
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  19. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    New Zealand Passenger lists. On the Ranana 15th Dec 1926 Miss J L G D'Elsa age 1 year 3 months born New Zealand From Wellington to Southampton. There is no one else with the D'Elsa name travelling with her but down further is a Mrs E J* Paull age 62 born Wales domestic duties. Is this Ediths mother?
    I think Joan is the eldest of the four children.
     
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2019
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  20. Archie's Mum

    Archie's Mum Always digging up clues

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    Have we found this before?????
    Birth certificate for Raydia?
    Father William Guy, mother Sophia Louise D'Elsa. He was 27 she was 39. Full name of child was Raydia Guy.
    I thought Radia belonged to Edith, apparently not.
     
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