WILLIAM TOMBS BORN 1695, WHEATLEY, OXON

Discussion in 'Oxfordshire' started by vickym, Feb 3, 2018.

  1. vickym

    vickym Member

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    I'm unable to reliably identify the above Wiliiam's parents/date of birth & death or confirm his marriage to Mary Todd.
    Can anyone help please

    Vicky.
     
  2. Sis

    Sis Rootles out resources!

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    I can only find what's on Ancestry trees and I would say that they've copied from other trees. There doesn't seem to be any evidence confirming what they have found.
     
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  3. vickym

    vickym Member

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    I also saw these details on Ancestry trees but thought they looked suspect. Will have to keep on digging.
     
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  4. Steve Bumstead

    Steve Bumstead Well-Known Member

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    Wheatley was in the parish of Cuddesdon and looking at the register I think there may be many entries missing - the period 1694-7 is a real mess with entries intermixed with the 1730s. There seem to be fewer entries in all for 1695 than one might expect comparing with other years. There were however two individuals, John and James Tombs who had children baptised in the 1680s.
     
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  5. janetbooth

    janetbooth Top Dog Stalwart

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    Nothing on the Oxfordshire Marriage Index for William TOMBS, or variants, to a Mary TODD. When were the first children of William born, Vicky, as that will give a timescale for his marriage.

    Janet
     
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  6. vickym

    vickym Member

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    The info I have for Wm & Mary is marriage 1728 Oxfordhire (cannot recall exactly where I got this from). However their first born was William 1728, Wheatley/Cuddesdon. They went on to have another 4 children between 1728/1738 all in Wheatley/Cuddesdon.
     
  7. Steve Bumstead

    Steve Bumstead Well-Known Member

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    There are no Tombs baptisms in the Cuddesdon register 1727-9, although there is a Richard Toms of Wheatley who has two daughters baptised in 1729. Could they have been nonconformists?
     
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  8. janetbooth

    janetbooth Top Dog Stalwart

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    As Steve has said, the registers of Cuddesdon for the periods you are interested in, are pretty messy. There is a burial at Cuddesdon on 6 March 1721/22 for a John TOMS of Wheatley and another on 31 March 1723 for a James TOMS of Wheatley. Burial on 20 February 1723/24 for a Mary TOMS of Wheatley and another one for Mary TOMS on 21 November 1738 - no other details given.

    Your William TOMBS may have married earlier than 1728 as both Ancestry and FMP have a transcription for the baptism at Cuddesdon on 10 April 1737 for a Frances TOM or TOMBS daughter of William TOM or TOMBS. Unfortunately, so far I have been unable to find the original register entry to check this transcript. There is a burial at Cuddesdon on 18 December 1791 of a William TOMBES of Wheatley, aged 75, therefore born c1716, have you come across him in your research, Vicky?

    Not having much luck I'm afraid.

    Janet
     
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  9. vickym

    vickym Member

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    Hi Janet,

    Your first para noted but not associated with my search.

    There are too many William & Mary Tombs in the Cuddesdon/Wheatley areas which create identification problems. The William circa 1716 isn't one I'm aware of, probably not the direct line I'm researching.

    What I have relating is:
    William Tombs 1695 marrying Mary Todd in 1728, their 5 children were;
    William 1728; Thomas 17xx; John 1731; Frances 1737 and Jeanette 1738

    then the William of 1728 married Mary Bennett 1754 (3 Aug). their children were: Mary 1755; John 1758; Elizabeth 1760; William 1763 and Thomas 1767

    The line I'm following is William 1695-1749 then William 1728 and onto John 1758-1795

    Will this info help at all with tracking the William 1695 parents?
     
  10. Steve Bumstead

    Steve Bumstead Well-Known Member

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    "What I have relating is:
    William Tombs 1695 marrying Mary Todd in 1728, their 5 children were;
    William 1728; Thomas 17xx; John 1731; Frances 1737 and Jeanette 1738

    then the William of 1728 married Mary Bennett 1754 (3 Aug). their children were: Mary 1755; John 1758; Elizabeth 1760; William 1763 and Thomas 1767

    The line I'm following is William 1695-1749 then William 1728 and onto John 1758-1795"

    Vicky, could you give us more detail please? For instance, where did the 1754 marriage take place? Where were the children of William Tombs and Mary Bennett baptised? And how can you be sure that "what I have...is" concerning William and Mary Todd and their children is correct?
     
  11. janetbooth

    janetbooth Top Dog Stalwart

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    Sorry, I think I am going slightly bonkers and misread 1738 for William jnr's baptism instead of 1728! Not too sure the above information will help, Vicky, because there are big gaps in the Cuddesdon register. There are baptisms up to 1684, absolutely beautiful legible writing as well, and then there appears to be a big gap just when your William would have been born.

    The reason I gave the burial dates for both John & James TOMS is because they were the males having children in Cuddesdon registers up until 1684 when the registers stop and either could perhaps be the father of your William.

    There are no baptisms in the register of Cuddesdon 1727-1741 for the children of William snr & Mary and the writing is beautifully legible but interestingly the date when Frances is supposed to have been baptised according to the transcript, i.e. 10 April 1737, there are no entries from 27 February to the beginning of May! William jnr's marriage to Mary BENNET at Cuddesdon in 1754 is there - he signed, she marked and the witnesses were Edward FRANKLIN & John BIGGES. Oxfordshire Marriage Index has a marriage for a Frances TOMBS to a John FRANKLIN at Great Haseley (not too far from Cuddesdon) on 9 August 1756. Marriage at Cuddesdon on 2 December 1751 of a John TOMBS & an Elizabeth LEAVER, both of the parish.

    I cannot find a burial for William TOMBS or variants in the parish register of Cuddesdon in 1749. Can you remember where you obtained this information?

    Janet
     
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  12. janetbooth

    janetbooth Top Dog Stalwart

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    From the parish register of Cuddesdon:

    5 October 1755 Mary daughter of William TOMBS of Wheatley
    2 April 1758 John son of William TOMBS of Wheatley
    7 September 1760 Elizabeth daughter of Wm & Mary TOMS of Wheatley
    21 August 1763 William son of Wm & Mary TOMBS of Wheatley

    Not too sure about the Thomas baptised in 1767. There is a baptism on 9 August 1767 of a Thomas son of William & Mary of Wheatley, but the surname looks to be longer than TOMS almost like TOMSINS.

    I think you are pretty safe as regards the ancestry of your John TOMBS in that he is the son of William TOMBS & Mary BENNET but given that we cannot find any baptism for William TOMBS c1728 relating to Cuddesdon or Wheatley and the parish registers are very legible, I am not too sure how you can safely say that he is the son of a William TOMBS & Mary TODD of Cuddesdon/Wheatley. Do you have William jnr's burial record, as so far I have been unable to find that with any certainty either and therefore have no approximate birthdate for him.

    Janet
     
  13. vickym

    vickym Member

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    Hi Janet,

    I spent y/day and today going through my notes. Unfortunately in the early days of writing up my records I failed to keep my original bits and pieces.
    Your current analysis of the situation....
    I think you are pretty safe as regards the ancestry of your John TOMBS in that he is the son of William TOMBS & Mary BENNET ......
    ....
    is a point that progressing further back requires more research, that is of the parents of William 1728. At this point I've only got a date of a William 1695-1749 marrying Mary Todd in 1728. As currently I'm only on Ancestry they have nothing else I can see that really matches. Having reached this brickwall, what suggestions do you have? (other than in future keeping all my notes).

    Vicky.
     
  14. janetbooth

    janetbooth Top Dog Stalwart

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    As far as I can see, it is going to be somewhat difficult. There are no actual parish register baptisms on Ancestry's Oxfordshire records for William jnr and any of his siblings you have. I haven't so far found a burial record for William jnr with any certainty either. We know he married in 1754 by banns so is likely to have been born before 1733 otherwise he would have needed a licence but then, at the moment, we come to a full stop.

    There is a marriage at Cuddesdon on 27 April 1767 of a Bartholomew CHAPMAN of Wheatley & Elizabeth THOMBES (signs TOMBES) both of Wheatley, by licence, which may be relevant to you, and another marriage at Cuddesdon on 16 May 1772 of a Thomas COOPER & Mary TOMBES, both of the parish. One of the witnesses was a Francis TOMBES - I don't know if this is relevant to your family or not. It looks as if Francis may have been from Wheatley as there is a baptismal record on 23 September 1781 of a William son of Francis & Sarah TOMBS of Wheatley.

    Going back to the baptism of Thomas in 1767, I have just found the burial record of a William TOMLINS of Wheatley at Cuddesdon on 6 November 1792, so I do think you have to be wary of attributing that Thomas as a son of your William TOMBS jnr. The only burial for a William TOMBS I can find at Cuddesdon is the one I have already mentioned in post 8 and as far as I can ascertain your John TOMBS does seem to stay in Wheatley which makes it more likely that father William would have been buried there too.

    Ah, just found a burial at Cuddesdon on 7 August 1808 of a Mary TOMBS of Wheatley, widow, aged 80, so could this be the widow of William jnr.

    I think what I would advise is to trawl through the parish registers of Cuddesdon prior to 1813 on Ancestry and make up some family trees because as far as I can see, there are not that many William TOMBS's of Wheatley in the parish registers and that may well clarify who fits where.

    I cannot see any relevant Oxfordshire Wills on FMP but you could consider looking for any PCC Wills. Also see if Oxfordshire Record Office have an online catalogue which may mention your families and look at the National Archives Online Catalogue.

    Sorry to appear somewhat negative, but the parish registers are the obvious place to start, going back from your John TOMBS, and I have always found making family trees extremely helpful in my own research.

    Janet
     
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  15. vickym

    vickym Member

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    Hi Janet,

    Thanks for all your information and suggestions. Now have quite a lot of researching to keep me busy over the next few days.

    Vicky
     
  16. janetbooth

    janetbooth Top Dog Stalwart

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    Good luck and let us know if we can help further.

    Janet
     

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