HELP identify the photo

HildaW

HildaW

Well-Known Member
This photo is my GGM sitting on her right is my Great Aunt Lily aged 8 -10 therefore the photo would be c1908 - 1910 taken near Liverpool. No writing on the back. Can anyone enlighten me as to why the children are all wearing sashes, bonnets and some are holding shepherd's crooks.
 

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If you think it could be around 1910, could it maybe be a celebration of some sort. George V coronation? They all look very regal and flowery.
I'm gathering that the sashes are red, white and blue and they are holding the flag as well.
I also considered May Day.
 
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Not so sure int's May Day, but could be wrong. Do you know the name of the school Hilda? Maybe there's a clue in what the gentleman is holding.

Capture2.JPG
 
The clip that Sis has done shows what I wanted to draw attention to. This sash has the letters LOL, which (as well as other more recent meanings) refers to a Loyal Orange Lodge.

This could make sense in Liverpool, as it's the main centre of the Orange Order in England. I think the number below could be the specific lodge number. It looks to me like 151 or 131, but I haven't managed to come up with anything for that. It may be a branch that no longer exists.

The main Orange processions etc are on 12 July, but I don't know if this is how children would dress for that.
 
There is a facebook sight called Grand Orange Lodge of England. Also they have a website.

Code: 
http://www.gole.org.uk/
 
Arthur, a million thanks this ties in with what I thought but could never prove BUT the photo was shown (by a friend for me) at the WDYTYA a few weeks ago and the expert advised it was a Friendly Society for Children in Need - hence the shepherds crooks but I cannot find anything that substantiates this.

Now the Orangemen fits in really well... as for the man in the corner we have no idea who he is... maybe Sarah's eldest son .... so irritating nothing written on it. I know there was a Ladies order for the LOL so still no definitive proof. The original photo is in the USA (I was sent a photocopy.. she does not do scanning) and she does not have the money the have it colourised to see the colour on the sashes... such a pity.

Sis I doubt it's a school, Sarah was not a school teacher.. if anything we thought it might be a Sunday School photo, (if not Orange Order) Easter bonnet parade. If a Friendly society of children in need then surely it would be all ladies cos the children would be too poor to have such pretty dresses and bonnets, that's the real reason I discounted what the "expert" said.
 
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Sis thanks for LOL info, I contacted them years ago and a very kind man did some hunting for me on my Dad's paternal lot they were all Orangemen (ex n ireland presbyterians) but he could not come up with anything. but I am going to go back and look further into lodge# 131 or 151 ... but I am getting when are you going to make lunch looks so better be off and feed the starving OH
 
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I've had a look for more Orange parade photos, and it seems children did sometimes wear this kind of thing:
Code: 
http://streetsofliverpool.co.uk/page/9/
(see posts of 24 Jun 2013 & 6 Jul 2013, about halfway down)

http://www.orange-pages.tk/histindex.htm?http://www.nethnavy.orange-pages.tk/
(just over halfway down)

http://musingsmmst.blogspot.co.uk/2016/07/orange-was-old-black-parading-in-toronto.html
(about a third of the way down, children in a parade float celebrating the British Empire as well as protestantism)

Other pages on the site in the second link mention having lots of parades each year, not just 12 July, but that's always the biggest one.

Incidentally, the person in the middle looks to have a sash with LOL as well.

Edited to add:
Another link - this page mentions LOL 131 as part of the Bootle Province:
Code: 
http://www.merseysiderollofhonour.co.uk/memorials/southsefton/bootle/bootleorangelodge.php
 
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I have just spent the last few hours looking at the links above, many thanks Arthur and various websites and one thing seems to stick out... the bands of colour on the Orangemen sash is large orange in the middle with small white on the edges... in the photo the sashes on the girls are more evenly spaced into what looks to be 3 colours and I cannot find any old pictures that resemble that "colour" configuration.
Clearly the man is wearing a sash that features LOL and it looks like 151 to me - cannot find any reference to this lodge# or 131.
My GGM might well be wearing an officer's ceremonial "collar" (not sure how to describe it) ...large panel darker colour in the middle on which is just visible an L. I have looked at the Ladies order but I can only find reference to this existing in Scotland.. so not much further ahead in my "proof" than I was but I am sure they are not a friendly society sash afterall. Thanks for all your help.
 
HildaW said:
... in the photo the sashes on the girls are more evenly spaced into what looks to be 3 colours and I cannot find any old pictures that resemble that "colour" configuration.
Click to expand...
I wonder if it could be the 'tricolour' of green, white and gold/orange that was adopted as the Irish flag in 1922. It had been around for a good 60-odd years before that so may well have been used in a ceremonial setting.

Just a thought.....
 
Daft Bat said:
I wonder if it could be the 'tricolour' of green, white and gold/orange that was adopted as the Irish flag in 1922. It had been around for a good 60-odd years before that so may well have been used in a ceremonial setting.

Just a thought.....
Click to expand...
:eek::eek::eek:

Sorry, Jan, I think an Orangeman (or woman) would rather go around naked than wear that. Although the use of orange was intended to portray the inclusion of the protestant community, I think the flag has generally been seen by them as a symbol of everything anti-British and anti-protestant.

If it's not the British red, white and blue, I wondered if it might be a nod towards the Dutch flag, whose colours are a bit paler than ours. One of the traditions of the 12 July parades, I found, was a couple of children dressing up and portraying William and Mary.
 
It is impossible to definitely determine which colours are in a black and white photograph, and it is even more complicated as, at that time, a film with reduced sensitivity to red (orthochromatic) would probably be used, which would make red items appear darker than in real life
 
Came across a photo taken in Toronto of a cartful of young women wearing similar attire, with their straw hats, a few with flowers. Juvenile Orange Lodge Branch 31 was written in the caption. The cart itself was covered with the same stripe fabric, (Red, white, blue?) union flags were being carried and the motto on the cart fabric, One God, One Faith, One Empire.
Daughters of William was another lodge that I have come across whilst searching that seems to be attached the Loyal Orange Lodge.
 
I wonder if the collar on the lady in the centre says FLOL, the ladies LOL.! The ladies LOL appears to have started in Sheerness and spread quite rapidly to South Africa. I only read a snippet.
 
I thought it might have something to do with Empire Day or May Day and found this film from the British Film Archive's wonderful collection. I don't think anyone is wearing a sash, but some do seem to be carrying crooks and there are an awful lot of flowery hats! Even if it isn't connected, it is worth watching.
http://
player.bfi.org.uk/film/watch-bootle-may-day-demonstration-and-crowning-of-the-may-queen-1903-1903/
 
Seems to be a 'player' thing Ladies, try this one:
Code: 
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/bootle-may-day-celebrations-aka-bootle-may-demonst
It is from 1922 tho'. sorry no crowning of Queenie.
Brown Uni. Library seems to have it but your needto join up etc..
 
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