Looking for pre widowed Surname

[rosie6]

Hi everyone.

My Great Grandmother x 3 Elizabeth Miller (Miller is her Widowed surname) married Nicholas Christian Hay on 6th March 1821.

6 Mar 1821 • Whitechapel High Street, St Mary's Middlesex, England by E, Mathias Rector. Witnesses Henry Chapman & Christiana Magson .

Pallots Marriage Index - A Widower. Gt Grandfather x 3 Both were Widows Signed by a X on marriage certificate

Nicholas Christian Hay ***!!​

1792–1851

I have over the years not been able to find anything to help trace her . Born around 1786 & died 2nd October 1853.

We know from documentation that her also Widowed husband Nicholas Christian Hay came from Bishopwearmouth in Durham, the reason I am on this site is because on Ancestry I came across a member who had Elizabeth Miller as being born in Durham, i wrote & asked her where the information that she was born in Durham came from & she believes it is from other Ancestry sites

.Now my maiden name is also Miller just to make things more complicated!!! She suggested I ask you guys for help with this search.
They had 3 daughters the youngest being my Gt Grandmother x 2

Mary Anne Hay born 1821 - 1913 married William Jennings
Rachel Tamar Hay born 1824-1908 married Alfred William Agar
Elizabeth Dorothea Hay born 1827-1898 married Francis Heird Bradfield (My Gt Grandmother x 2)

They lived in the docklands area & Nicholas was a Mariner, they lived in Princes Court/Princes Street, now Raine street.and all the family were in that area, other than my Gt Grandparents x 2 lived in Marylebone.

if anyone can help great & huge thanks in advance for reading this

Rosie

 

[Andromeda]

As she was a widow at marriage it's possible that Elizabeth already had children from her first marriage. Have you obtained her death certificate to see who the informant was?

I see she was buried at St George in the East, which is also where Elizabeth Jr married, so this could be her in 1841:

Workhouse, Old Gravel Lane, St George in the East
Elizabeth Hay 55 Pauper Servant - Born in County

I think I've also found Elizabeth Jr, but if this is Elizabeth Sr then the census suggests she was born in London, not Durham. There may also be some further documents in the poor law records - I'll try and look later tonight.

 

[Andromeda]

If that is Elizabeth in the St George in the East Workhouse, then there are several admissions for her

Elizabeth Hay born 1785 Admitted 6 Feb 1841, discharged 17 Aug 1842. Ward No. 10
Elizabeth Hay born 1785 Admitted 29 Sep 1842, discharged 24 Oct 1842. Remarks: to Nurse
Elizabeth Hay born 1785 Admitted 12 Jan 1843, discharged 24 Feb 1843. Remarks: to Nurse
Elizabeth Hay born 1785, widow, Admitted 22 Dec 1846. Not able bodied due to age, seeking relief due to destitution.
(Possible discharge date 8 Mar 1858)

I'll keep looking for anything else

 

[Andromeda]

I've tried looking for a settlement record for her but unfortunately I can't find anything. Ancestry haven't transcribed most of them and their labelling of the films is pretty rubbish too, so there's still a possibility that something might turn up in the future.

 

[rosie6]

Thank you so much for your message. I thought you may find these helpful. I do not have Elizabeth seniors death certificate.
I have never seen any other possible children of Elizabeth's in any censuses unfortunately
Elizabeth's husband Nicholas, his mother was a Mary Miller which may or may not be significant if Elizabeth Miller was from the family. The photo is of Elizabeth Hay my Great Grandmother x 2.

 

[rosie6]

I've tried looking for a settlement record for her but unfortunately I can't find anything. Ancestry haven't transcribed most of them and their labelling of the films is pretty rubbish too, so there's still a possibility that something might turn up in the future.

Thank you so much. You never know do you, i will keep on looking

 

[Andromeda]

It may be worth obtaining the death certificate to see who the informant was, just in case - you can download a pdf instantly for £3 at gro.gov.uk

Also if Elizabeth Sr died in 1853 then that last discharge I posted can't be her so I'll see if I can find an alternative.

 

[rosie6]

Yes i think there is another Elizabeth Hay in the area, they were all around tge St George in the East area

 

[Andromeda]

Yes i think there is another Elizabeth Hay in the area, they were all around tge St George in the East area

The 'iffy' discharge I posted was Hays or Hayes, but all the admissions were Hay which is why I was unsure of it in the first place.

 

[Andromeda]

I may have found a 'Miller' daughter for Elizabeth!

Baptism at St John Zachary, London (transcript only)
20 Aug 1809 (born 30 Jul 1809) Ann Elizabeth d/o Henry & Elizabeth MILER (sic)

Marriage at St George in the East, Cannon Street
30 Sep 1830
Daniel DAVIS (but signed as DAVIES), Bachelor of this parish
Ann Elizabeth MILLER, spinster of same parish
Witnesses: Stephen Buchell & Elizabeth HAY

The reason I'm fairly excited about this find is that the person I thought was Elizabeth Hay Jr is in the 1841 census with this couple.
ADDED: Daniel Davies was also the witness at Elizabeth Hay's 1845 marriage to Francis Heird Bradfield. His signature looks the same on both documents:

3 Hilliards Court, St George in the East
Daniel DAVIS 40 Mariner
Ann DAVIS 27
Elizabeth HAY 14 Umberella Maker

All born in County

There seems to be two possible marriages in London for a Henry Miller and Elizabeth:
27 Dec 1805 at St Mary, Hornsey Rise (Islington), Henry MILLER otp, widower & Elizabeth BANKS, Spinster - OR -
31 July 1806 at St Mary at Lambeth, Henry MILLER bachelor otp and Elizabeth GOLD of the same parish, spinster

The second seems more likely, but both need more investigation. There are also possible burials for Henry Miller that need looking into.

 

[Andromeda]

I can't edit the above post any more, but the 'at St Mary's Whitechapel' at the bottom is there in error - I think I was posting a possible burial for Henry Miller but thought better of it as I wasn't sure.

 

[Daft Bat]

I can't edit the above post any more, but the 'at St Mary's Whitechapel' at the bottom is there in error - I think I was posting a possible burial for Henry Miller but thought better of it as I wasn't sure.

Sorted.