Brick Wall: Identifying Father of Rose Children (1920–27), Grainger Co. TN / Rossville GA

[DrgnAngel13]

I’m working on a long‑standing brick wall involving the father of three children born to Lillie Mae Hunley/Savage between 1920–1927.
Children:
• Ethel Mae Rose (~1921)
• Willie Lee Rose (~1921–22)
• Betty Jean Rose (~1927)
Lillie Mae married William Daris Crowe in 1928 in Grainger County, TN. All three Rose children appear in later records as siblings.
Suspected father:
Some combination of the names:
Oscar Franklin Rose / Frank Oscar Rose / Oscar F. Rose
Estimated birth: 1890–1905
Seeking:
• Any record of this Rose man in TN/GA
• Possible marriage to Lillie Mae
• Draft cards, census entries, or local directories
• Connections to Rose families in Grainger Co. or Rossville
Any leads or suggestions welcome.

 

[GrannyBarb]

Hi, and welcome!
FamilySearch has a research wiki that can give suggestions for records by locality. Unfortunately, I can't access it at the moment. Also, local libraries and state archives are useful for finding records.
Best wishes.

 

[Ma-dotcom]

Looking about I was only able to find Willie Lee Rose, who claims birth in 1922 Jacksonville, Florida he connects with Lillie /Lily as Mother. You may already have all of this but if so, read no further. Apologies for length of post.
b.11 Mar. 1922 Jacksonville Florida Mrs Lilly May Crose Rutledge Tennessee
------------
Name Willie Lee Rose
Race White
Age 23
Birth Date 11 Mar 1922
Birth Place Jacksonville, Florida
Residence Place Knoxville, Knox, Tennessee
Registration Date 18 Dec 1945
Registration Place Knoxville, Knox, Tennessee
Employer None
Height 5 10
Weight 161
Complexion Ruddy
Hair Color Brown
Eye Color Blue
Next of Kin Mrs Lilly May Crose /Crowe?

Household Members (Name)
Willie Lee Rose
----------

Name Willie L Rose
Age 28
Birth Date abt 1922
[abt 1922]
Gender Male
Race White
Birth Place Florida
Marital Status Married
Relation to Head of House Head
Residence Date 1950
Home in 1950 Grainger, Tennessee, USA
Street Name Indian Ridge Road
Apartment Number O Ft
Dwelling Number 95
Farm Yes
Questionnaire Number 79
Occupation Farm Hand
Industry Farm
Occupation Category Working
Worked Last Week Yes
Hours Worked 35
Worker Class Private
Household Members (Name) Age Relationship
Willie L Rose 28 Head
Mary J Rose-23-Wife -divorce in 1964
Connie Rose-1-Daughter
Grover Crowe-18-Brother
Source Citation
National Archives at Washington, DC; Washington, D.C.; Seventeenth Census of the United States, 1950; Year: 1950; Census Place: Grainger, Tennessee; Roll: 3565; Page: 11; Enumeration District: 29-4
--------
The Knoxville News-Sentinel
Knoxville, Tennessee · Thursday, May 20, 1954

Marriage
Grover Elmer Crowe & Pauline Clearissie Hurst
Name
Grover Elmer Crowe
Spouse
Pauline Clearissie Hurst
Other Details
Residences
Route 4, Rutledge, Route 2, Knoxville
-------------
Name
Willie L. Rose
Birth -11 Mar 1922
Death -25 Dec 2005
Residence-Before 1951 Tennessee

-------------------

https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/94929768/grover-elmer-crowe

with Obit/
-------------------------

 

[Archie's Mum]

Just to add, Lillie Mae married Darius Crowe as Lillie Mae Hunley. Lillie was born to George Hunley/Hundley and Nettie Savage in 1898. George and Nettie married in 1901, 3 years after Lillle was born.
There is a Franklin Oscar Rose in Tennessee at the same time but married to another, perhaps the same man living a double life with a subtle name change. Also an Oscar Franklin Rose married to an Alice, from Roane Tennessee, children all born around the same time as Lillies children. This Oscar can be found on Find a Grave Tennessee.

 

[Archie's Mum]

This is quite confusing.
William Darius Crowe married Della Ester Archer in 1914. Sometime later they divorced but not until they had 3 children. Cecil Haley 1919, William Oscar 1922, Mossie Jane 1924. All born Grainger.
In 1928 Darius Crowe (Darius not William Darius) married Lillie Mae Hanley (marriage licence on FS) then in 1934 they had a son William Darius Crowe in Grainger. Info found on Find a Grave.
Could these three children born to William Darius and Della be the three children in post number 1 but with changed names? All the birth years are very close to the three of Della and William Darius. Could Lillie be their step mother rather than their natural mother?

 

[Archie's Mum]

To add Cecil Haley Crowe is female not male.

 

[Archie's Mum]

In post #3 Lillie May as next of kin is known as Lillie May Crose or Crowe. ‘Crose’ is pretty close to ‘Rose’ …I still believe they are William Darius’ children by his first wife Della with maybe a reason to change their names. I think your Oscar Franklin Rose is a red herring and not at all connected to Lillie Mae.

 

[Grizel]

I'm not so sure AM. Although Willie Lee Rose and William Oscar Crowe have birthdays close together, both men can be followed separately.

 

[DrgnAngel13]

This is quite confusing.
William Darius Crowe married Della Ester Archer in 1914. Sometime later they divorced but not until they had 3 children. Cecil Haley 1919, William Oscar 1922, Mossie Jane 1924. All born Grainger.
In 1928 Darius Crowe (Darius not William Darius) married Lillie Mae Hanley (marriage licence on FS) then in 1934 they had a son William Darius Crowe in Grainger. Info found on Find a Grave.
Could these three children born to William Darius and Della be the three children in post number 1 but with changed names? All the birth years are very close to the three of Della and William Darius. Could Lillie be their step mother rather than their natural mother?

No they aren't the three Rose children that I am looking for the father's records for but they are my line same family. You are correct that both William Darius Crowe with Della Archer and Darius Crowe with Lillie Mae Hunley are indeed the same man. Actually there were three girls and two boys between William and Della because there was also Walter Verlin and Willie Mae (female) but Willie Mae (also female) died age 2. While Lillie Mae Savage Hunley had at least the three prior to marrying William that I know of (Ethel Mae, Betty Jean, and Willie Lee / Lea?). Then together they have Harley Howard, Grover Elmer, Danie E, William Daris Jr, Bertha Mae, and Wilma Jean. There is also a Francis (female) but couldn't swear whether she is a half sibling from one of their prior relationships or a child of theirs together. Trust me your confusion is felt by me when I first started looking into it and realized how many siblings my grandfather truly had (although I knew a good portion of them including Ethel) but more so I was confused by the fact that they were half siblings because I had always thought they were all Crowes.

 

[DrgnAngel13]

Between them all you can see that there were indeed three separate sets of children between Lillie and William Daris... his, hers, and theirs but especially William Daris Crowe Sr's obituary shows that Mossie Jane and Cecil Haley are separate individuals then Ethel Mae and Betty Jean.

 

[Archie's Mum]

All I can say is that Oscar Franklin Rose was a very busy man, if indeed he is your man.
Oscar Franklin Rose married (according to FS tree) Myra Alice Evans 25/12/1914 Roane County Tennessee.
Oscar and Myra, known as Alice, had…according to Find a Grave..Ruth 1915, Mable 1917, Rue 1919, Anna Margaret 1921, Mary Pat 1923, Bertie Wayne 1925, Emma 1932, Myra 1933. All of these were born in Roane County.
Roane County is 81 miles from Grainger County and Florida, the place Willie Lea claims to be born, is over 700 miles away. He being born between Anna Margaret 1921and Mary Pat 1923.

 

[Archie's Mum]

A breakthrough, just a small one.
Kentucky Vital Record Indexes 1911-1999
ETHEL MAE ROSE
27/1/1921
FRANKLIN, KENTUCKY
Mother, Lillie SAVAGE. No father.
A coincidence that FRANKLIN is the place of birth!

 

[Archie's Mum]

1940 Census, Knox Tennessee..Who is William Cole and his wife Lula? Is this Lillie with another husband and a changed name? Or is supposed to be William Crowe and Lillie?
Willie Lea is 18, then there is Cornelia 14. Who is Cornelia? Betty Jean? She is the same age as Betty Jean!
Harley, Grover and Bertha Mae follow on the census and they are all a son or daughter to the head and his wife!
How do you know the name Oscar Franklin or combinations? Was this name mentioned by family?