Permission to marry in 1879?

kernowmaid

kernowmaid

Our very own Cornish Maid
I know the answer to this question is out there somewhere, but I'm blowed if I can find it! So I've come to the fount of all genealogical knowledge - Top Dog!

I'm puzzled why my great-granma didn't marry my great-grandad until 2 years after their first child was born. She went on to have 13 more children with him, so it can't have been indecision! Possibly, great-grandad didn't want to marry (this is Edward Copley, who I've mentioned before - a vicious villain, always in trouble with the law).

But I also wonder whether she had to wait to be "of age". Mary Alice Brown, born August 1859, her mother died between 1871 & 1881. She left home (Belton, Leicestershire) between 1871 & 1881. And met Edward. In 1879, aged 19yrs, she gave birth to their first child - Elizabeth, birthplace Rempston, Nottinghamshire.

From this date she remains in Nottinghamshire. In the 1881 census, the child is with its grandparents (Edward's parents). Did Mary Alice run away from home? Did her father throw her out when she got pregnant? I'll never know for sure. There is no indication that any of her family attended the wedding in September 1881.

So ... (sorry, I got carried away with the story!) ... my question is - in 1879/1880, what was the age required in order to marry without a parent's permission? And if you were underage - how was the parent's permission obtained/recorded?

Jane
 
21. Banns of marriage had to be called showing the intent to marry. If that was in the bride or groom's parish the parishioners would know how old they were. I don't think the parents permission was recorded anywhere.
 
Was she living with him but just not married? The parish normally liked to keep an eye on that sort of thing so that they did not become a burden on the parish. Intriguing though. Where did they marry?
 
Thank you Blackmogs.
They married at the Register Office in the district of Basford. (Not sure if this is actually Basford, or perhaps Bulwell where they - and Edward's parents - lived.)
I get the impression that they were already living together - and that it was the sort of area where no-one would be bothered what age they were. If they married under-age, without permission, would legal action have been taken? Or would the vicar refuse to marry them?
Also ... were the banns recorded? Would I be able to find them? Where do I look?

Questions, Questions ... ("Why is the grass green? What do cows eat? Why aren't cows green?" - I shall never forget the trip from Derbyshire to Cornwall when our 5-year old spent the whole journey asking Questions! I lost my patience before Bristol. "Just BECAUSE!")

Jane
 
Last edited:
Could Edward have been incarcerated and not free to marry?

Lots of underaged girls declared 'of full age' and married regardless away from their home parish.
 
Good Thinking, MollyMay. I shall have to dig out those newspaper reports - although I don't think he was ever sentenced to more than 30 days. And I think Mary Alice may have been pregnant again when she married - GRO & I are having trouble finding the correct birth cert for second child Joseph.
 
Some Banns survive. I cannot find a marriage on the Notts FHS CD which does have transcripts for both Bullwell and Basford. But can see that three of their children, William, Harriet and Joseph were baptised on the same day 17 Feb 1886 at Bulwell, they were living at 9 West Row. For two of those baptisms he is described as a collier but for the third he is a labourer. Then there are 2 more baptisms at Bulwell one in 1893 Sarah Annie and the other 1894 Fanny. In 1900 there is a baptism for Charles Henry at Arnold St Mary. But one thing you said earlier which is interesting. I didn't know that one could be married in a Registry Office as early as that.
 
Blackmogs said:
I didn't know that one could be married in a Registry Office as early as that.
Click to expand...
Registry Office marriages started with the introduction of Civil Registration on 1st July 1837. :)

I wonder who the first one was......
 
Blackmogs said:
Some Banns survive. I cannot find a marriage on the Notts FHS CD which does have transcripts for both Bullwell and Basford. But can see that three of their children, William, Harriet and Joseph were baptised on the same day 17 Feb 1886 at Bulwell, they were living at 9 West Row. For two of those baptisms he is described as a collier but for the third he is a labourer. Then there are 2 more baptisms at Bulwell one in 1893 Sarah Annie and the other 1894 Fanny. In 1900 there is a baptism for Charles Henry at Arnold St Mary. But one thing you said earlier which is interesting. I didn't know that one could be married in a Registry Office as early as that.
Click to expand...

Thanks for looking, Blackmogs.
Yes, I think Mary Alice "got religion" - her daughter Annie (my Gran) was very strict C of E.
Yet I can't find the baptisms for all the children (including Annie herself!). I'd missed Fanny - thank you for finding her. Sarah Annie was baptised 3 days before she died from Scarlet Fever, age 17 months. Charles Henry was baptised on the very day he died, aged 10 months - poor babes, just what they needed, a dousing of cold water. :eek:

Jane
 
My gg grandparents married after the birth of their first two children and actually at the time when their third child was well on the way! I have no idea why they left it so long to actually tie the knot, as they were obviously living together for some years before deciding to do so.

My gg grandmother was most definitely 'of full age' when she fell pregnant with her first child, so it wasn't a case there of her being unable to marry because she was still a minor! I might add that it took me many years to find their marriage as although I did look for a year or so after the birth of the first child, I did not extend my search to when their third was on the way for a very long time!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top