Several Richard Dales and some marriages to Elisabeth and others

Murfomurf

Murfomurf

Well-Known Member
This is a tangle:
Richard Dale, of either Cheshire or Staffordshire (god forbid MORE) married an Elisabeth, most trees say Elisabeth Harrison.
This Richard Dale (there are 7...) had a father, Richard Dale senior, but his mother could be Ann, Elisabeth or someone new.
The Richard I have was said to be born in 1775 in Audley, Staffordshire (or my alternative is in Astbury, Cheshire).
One tree-owner says he married in 1789, which I'm sure this one did not! The other has him marrying Elisabeth Harrison in Astbury in 1796, which doesn't quite convince me as there was another Richard BORN in Astbury who could have married her.
The references saying that Richard's father was Richard senior don't really help and the array of women to be his mother is not presented in the marriage documents.

Other Richards born around the same time married:
Susannah Kemp 14 Nov 1808 in Stratford, Warwickshire;
Ann Allkins 14 Jan 1794 in Stafford, Staffordshire;
Mary Clark 26 Jun 1803 in Norton le Moors, Staffordshire;
Elizabeth Thomas 27 Sep. 1807 in Llangibby, Monmouth, Wales;
Mary Smith 2 Oct 1815 in Stafford, Staffordshire.

There are patterns in my tree of people from Cheshire or Wales marrying each other and crossing the "border" between censuses that can't be ignored either.

My basic questions:

Which Richard Dale married Elisabeth Harrison and who were his parents?
 
The only baptism for a child of Richard & Elizabeth DALE I can find at Astbury according to the Bishop's Transcripts is a Joseph baptised on 15 October 1797, son of Richard & Elisabeth DALE of Odd Rode. Baptism at Astbury on 14 May 1775 for a Richard son of Richard DALE & Ann of Odd Rode, so they sound likely parents for the Richard who married Elisabeth HARRISON - unfortunately there were no further details on the marriage entry of Richard & Elisabeth, so not much help there. Burial at Astbury on 17 November 1840 for a Richard DALE of Odd Rode, aged 65. His Will is available to view on FMP but he seems to be married to a Sarah. Looking for any baptisms to this Richard & Sarah there appear to be at least two I have found, Elizabeth in 1824 and John in 1829 both stating that the couple were of Odd Rode.

Sarah DALE is living in Odd Rode in the 1841 census (HO107/119/22, folio 5, page 5), aged 55, Farmer, together with a Joseph DALE, aged 19, (both of these not born in the county), Elizabeth & John DALE (ages 15 & 12 respectively and born in the county). Next household down in a Richard DALE, Farmer, & his family, aged 30, not born in the county - a son Richard is mentioned in Richard DALE's 1840 Will.

Not sure whether this helps or muddies the water even further, but I think it probably tells you who are the parents of the Richard DALE who married Elisabeth HARRISON.

According to the 1851 census of Odd Rode, Sarah DALE was born in Shropshire - no wonder I couldn't find a marriage!!

Janet
 
Thanks @Janet I think I can work with that! I certainly don't have your knack with the census! I will put in all your finds and see if a family distills out!
 
Hope it turns out to be a help! Could this be a link to Staffordshire regarding the Joseph DALE aged 19 in the 1841 census of Odd Rode? Baptism at Audley, Staffordshire on 27 January 1822 for a Joseph son of Richard & Sarah DALE, Talke, Farmer. Talke is not so very far from Odd Rode. This could perhaps be Joseph DALE living in Smallwood, Cheshire in the 1851 census (HO107/2168, folio 7, page 7). The writing is pretty indistinct but his birthplace looks as if it could read Staffordshire, Odd Rode - what do you think?? Also another baptism at Audley on 20 March 1808 (born December 7 1807) for Richard son of Richard & Elizabeth DALE, so perhaps first wife Elizabeth died in Staffordshire. Burial at Audley on 14 May 1810 for an Elizabeth daughter of Richard & Elizabeth DALE and a burial at Audley on 4 June 1812 for Elizabeth wife of Richard DALE. Hope this helps further.

Janet
 
@janetbooth I'm getting a bit tangled in the three Joseph Dales I discovered, but I can see the 1851 census HO107/2168, folio 7, page 7. definitely says Odd Rode although the scan is very faint. One Joseph also has a wife 1 Eliza Proudlove with 2 children Proudlove, then wife 2 Susan; parents by my reckoning Samuel Dale and Mary Plant- maybe I mixed up the Josephs as this one seems to have birth at Odd Rode but Baptism Church-Lawton 8 Apr 1821. I think I need to check each Census for current location vs birth location and maybe some switcheroo necessary!
 
Aha! Since Richard b 1775 first married Elisabeth Harrison, then Sarah Vicerton/Vickerton in 1820, the Joseph I am probably supposed to be focusing on was baptised to this pair, and he would have been about 19 in the 1841 Census:
Joseph Dale
Baptism Date 27 Jan. 1822
Baptism Place Audley, St James the Great, Staffordshire, England
Religion Anglican
Father Richard Dale
Mother Sarah Dale
Page number 139
 
Yes, that is the one I found but there are an awful lot of DALEs around in the vicinity of Odd Rode:(. Just found a marriage licence record dated 22 February 1850 for Joseph DALE of Odd Rode parish of Astbury, Farmer & Ann EDWARDS, widow, of Smallwood & Astbury which certainly ties in with the Joseph DALE in Smallwood in the 1851 census, but wouldn't you just know it I cannot find the actual marriage record to confirm his father's name! Baptism at Astbury on 12 January 1851 for Ann daughter of Joseph & Ann DALE - presumably the 3 month old daughter in the 1851 census record. The other 3 children in the 1851 census may have been the children of Thomas & Ann EDWARDS, he being a Farmer at Spen Green, Charles EDWARDS being baptised at Astbury in 1845.

However, there is an article in the Macclesfield Courier dated 7 August 1858 re the auction of a freehold farm in Smallwood in the tenancy of Richard & Joseph DALE who are apparently leaving the farm, so could these be the Richard & Joseph sons of Richard DALE & his two wives Elizabeth & Sarah?

Joseph & Ann DALE plus family are in the 1861 census of Smallwood. Looking for the birth registration of their daughter Mary shows a birth registered at Congleton reg district in 1845, mother's maiden name HOLLINSHEAD and there is a marriage licence bond dated 30 January 1844 for a Thomas EDWARDS of Smallwood & an Ann HOLLINSHEAD. This looks to have confirmed the parentage of Charles & Thomas EDWARDS in the 1851 census record but not the Rebecca aged 7.

Hope this doesn't muddy the waters too much for you.

Janet
 
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